Floyd Mayweather or Sugar Ray Leonard, who was more talented?

[CastletonSnob]

I've been watching Floyd and Leonard's early fights lately. Both had great amateur careers. Obviously, they were both incredibly talented fighters. But who would you say was more talented?

 

[Seano]

hmmm

Leonard probably was the more athletic, physically gifted fighter. Floyd probably had the higher ring IQ.

I'd say Floyd, overall. Ray was a stepping stone at an age where Floyd was still P4P. Leonard certainly had some things that Floyd did not though.

 

[stuff jones]

Define talent. Is having a risk averse style that allows you to be successful while your physical talents have declined a talent?

 

[deucesarewild]

Ray on all fronts. Better IQ, too. Look at how he fought Benitez and exposed his jab, Duran and then rematched him (a close first loss that was about as close as Mayweather disputable win over Castillo who is far inferior to Duran), Hearns, who he modied mid-fight for and then KO'd, and then against Hagler after three years off.

Leonard, in my opinion. He was better and his top wins are all against guys who are legit killers all closer to their primes.

Mayweather gets mad respect for having a consistently longer peak, but he doesn't have the ceiling Ray Leonard does.

 

[Seano]

Ray on all fronts. Better IQ, too. Look at how he fought Benitez and exposed his jab, Duran and then rematched him (a close first loss that was about as close as Mayweather disputable win over Castillo who is far inferior to Duran), Hearns, who he modied mid-fight for and then KO'd, and then against Hagler after three years off.

Leonard, in my opinion. He was better and his top wins are all against guys who are legit killers all closer to their primes.

Mayweather gets mad respect for having a consistently longer peak, but he doesn't have the ceiling Ray Leonard does.

He got suckered into Durans fight and lost how can you say he was the smarter ring technician?

 

[LoneStalker]

To me, Ray. Until today, I consider his fight against Wilfredo Benítez a piece of art.

 

[Yacob]

Leonard offensively was quite something...like a mini Ali.

Floyd obviously had better defensive skills but his offense was much much better than people seem to acknowledge

I'd say Floyd more talented BUT in head to head, i think Leonard would really give Floyd problems...i favor SRL in that sense. Imo Leonard and Hearns both would be absolute nightmares for Floyd

 

[svmVR2097]

Ray on all fronts. Better IQ, too. Look at how he fought Benitez and exposed his jab, Duran and then rematched him (a close first loss that was about as close as Mayweather disputable win over Castillo who is far inferior to Duran), Hearns, who he modied mid-fight for and then KO'd, and then against Hagler after three years off.

Leonard, in my opinion. He was better and his top wins are all against guys who are legit killers all closer to their primes.

Mayweather gets mad respect for having a consistently longer peak, but he doesn't have the ceiling Ray Leonard does.

Floyd would’ve absolutely tooled Duran in the second fight too, considering how out of shape he got between fights

 

[Yacob]

Floyd would’ve absolutely tooled Duran in the second fight too, considering how out of shape he got between fights

Duran sold himself short.

He had potential to emerge as best out of the big 4

 

[tekkennlee]

Floyd is the better overall boxer and hsd better defense and ring IQ.

Ray was faster and more flashy had the smile and Olympic darling but he had problems against inside fighters like Duran Terry Norris and ot

Leonard offensively was quite something...like a mini Ali.

Floyd obviously had better defensive skills but his offense was much much better than people seem to acknowledge

I'd say Floyd more talented BUT in head to head, i think Leonard would really give Floyd problems...i favor SRL in that sense. Imo Leonard and Hearns both would be absolute nightmares for Floyd

Floyd's Father gave Ray lots of trouble and Jr is a better fighter with better defense and even Emanuel Stewart corrected himself in the Shane and Floyd fight because he always thought Floyd couldn't handle Ray and Duran and Hearns because he thought Floyd was to small and wasn't strong enough but Emanuel said Floyd was way stronger then Shane in their fight who was bigger and could bench 300 pounds and Stewart had to correct himself and rethink his views, Floyd was very strong he's pushing Shane around.

1978-09-09 Ray Leonard vs Floyd Mayweather Sr

 

[Yacob]

Floyd is the better overall boxer and hsd better defense and ring IQ.

Ray was faster and more flashy had the smile and Olympic darling but he had problems against inside fighters like Duran Terry Norris and ot



Floyd's Father gave Ray lots of trouble and Jr is a better fighter with better defense and even Emanuel Stewart corrected himself in the Shane and Floyd fight because he always thought Floyd couldn't handle Ray and Duran and Hearns because he thought Floyd was to small and wasn't strong enough but Emanuel said Floyd was way stronger then Shane in their fight who was bigger and could bench 300 pounds and Stewart had to correct himself and rethink his views, Floyd was very strong he's pushing Shane around.

1978-09-09 Ray Leonard vs Floyd Mayweather Sr

Floyd Sr was actually quite good. Just because his style and cleverness gave Ray a bit of trouble doesn't say much imo....Emmanuel Augustus was a .500 fighter and gave Floyd absolute fits.

And Floyd is much much faster than Leonard....Floyd's hand speed is legitimately at an all time elite level for any weight. He was so fucking fast.

 

[svmVR2097]

Duran sold himself short.

He had potential to emerge as best out of the big 4

P4P wise he was. Not going to sell him short but that was a career defining moment for both Leonard and Duran, and he should’ve known that.

 

[Yacob]

P4P wise he was. Not going to sell him short but that was a career defining moment for both Leonard and Duran, and he should’ve known that.

He totally lost all motivation.

But a hungry, young Duran was fucking dangerous. Dude was a PROBLEM

 

[deucesarewild]

He got suckered into Durans fight and lost how can you say he was the smarter ring technician?

Noice, I referenced the rematch. Anyway, there were a bunch of interviews at the time. Going into that fight, Ray and Angelo both admitted openly to training to step into Duran's attack.

The "suckering" was revisionist history. Anyway the fact he made it close in spite of that in the first one (as close as any of Mayweather's razor close wins, like Castillo, that could have been a loss) is impressive.

 

[deucesarewild]

He totally lost all motivation.

But a hungry, young Duran was fucking dangerous. Dude was a PROBLEM

He won a MW belt at age, what, 37 when his most destructive work was at LW. Duran is special. Dominant in the 70's, uneven in the 80's. When he came to play, you had to earn every second of the fight.

 

[Ultra O’Dia]

Ray on all fronts. Better IQ, too. Look at how he fought Benitez and exposed his jab, Duran and then rematched him (a close first loss that was about as close as Mayweather disputable win over Castillo who is far inferior to Duran), Hearns, who he modied mid-fight for and then KO'd, and then against Hagler after three years off.

Leonard, in my opinion. He was better and his top wins are all against guys who are legit killers all closer to their primes.

Mayweather gets mad respect for having a consistently longer peak, but he doesn't have the ceiling Ray Leonard does.

i like all of this except i honestly dont think Castillo was far inferior to Duran.

 

[-Magua-]

hmmm

Leonard probably was the more athletic, physically gifted fighter. Floyd probably had the higher ring IQ.

I'd say Floyd, overall. Ray was a stepping stone at an age where Floyd was still P4P. Leonard certainly had some things that Floyd did not though.

I scan agree with that to a degree, yet I feel if they met at their respective prime, I favor SRL.

 

[djacobox372]

Leonard was more talented, but floyd is WAY more skilled.

As soon as Leonard slowed down in his mid 30's he started getting his ass kicked.

 

[defjaam]

Short answer: Floyd.
Ray has better power, but aside from that he really doesn't have anything on Floyd. I guess you could point out the charisma gap between the two, because it can be a factor when it goes to the scorecards. Everything else is a difference in style, not in talent.

Ray's power also won him the fight against Tommy Hearns. And his charisma was a factor vs. Marvin @Hagler.

A question though: If Ray was so much of a better athlete, why didn't he have a pull counter like Floyd?

 

[eternaldarkness]

Short answer: Floyd.
Ray has better power, but aside from that he really doesn't have anything on Floyd. I guess you could point out the charisma gap between the two, because it can be a factor when it goes to the scorecards. Everything else is a difference in style, not in talent.

Ray's power also won him the fight against Tommy Hearns. And his charisma was a factor vs. Marvin @Hagler.

A question though: If Ray was so much of a better athlete, why didn't he have a pull counter like Floyd?

Pull counters are regarded as shit by traditionalists.