Boxing vs MMA : Using the "streetfight approach"

zab judah has a documented street fight win streak(thats news to me). didn't he run away from a couple of thugs? there's plenty of other boxers with street fight experience. i remember reading that jeff fenech knocked out a 230 pound bouncer with one punch?

A poster here made an account of all known street-fights Zab had. One included Busta Rhymes who's like 6'4" 220. And there's a myspace vid of Zab flooring a couple of chumps who tried to screw him out of a dice game, both of them being 30-50 lbs heavier than him. At any case, his street fighting record is more credible than Rickson Gracie's.
 
It's one thing to believe that. It's another thing to take a punch from a person trained to punch accurately and end it up on the ground. There's always an excuse, Jean Claude Van Damme had a pretty nice excuse as to why he got splattered in a restaurant. The old "I would have beaten him up, but I slipped."

Point is in the street nothing is impossible, nothing is necessarily reliable, and only a fool believes any ONE thing will ALWAYS happen, including grappling.
 
It's one thing to believe that. It's another thing to take a punch from a person trained to punch accurately and end it up on the ground. There's always an excuse, Jean Claude Van Damme had a pretty nice excuse as to why he got splattered in a restaurant. The old "I would have beaten him up, but I slipped."

Point is in the street nothing is impossible, nothing is necessarily reliable, and only a fool believes any ONE thing will ALWAYS happen, including grappling.

Im not a grappling nuthugger, check my post #20 why igor would be the best streetfighter ever
 
It's all good. I just think it's terribly pretentious of people (not necessarily you, just generally) to speculate how situations with innumerable variables will end up. Especially when they bring in percentages. "80% of street fights end up on the ground." Yeah, and 99% of statistics are made up.
 
There's nothing stopping the boxer from kicking the downed opponent in the head neither to finish him off. One gets the impression that some people think a boxer's going to abide by the rules of boxing even in a street-fight?! A hell of a lot of pro boxers were rough troubled kids involved in plenty of violent no-holds barred street-fights.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JgAgifClrt8
 
that's like the guys who don't train who says: "your grappling would not work on me I would just grab your balls", well just try it man, just try it

what If I bit your balls? hahahaha
 
the typical MMA figher has enough striking skills to defeat your average thug. the typical boxer has way, way more than enough striking skills to defeat your average thug. the MMA figher has even more skills on top of that, the boxer... .not necessarily.

p.s. I am not saying that boxers can't handle themselves in street fights, but I am trying to turn back this idea that the MMA fighter is more likely to lose because his striking skills are inferior. the MMA fighter's striking skills may be inferior relative to the boxer's, but it is still more than enough to prepare the MMA fighter for a street fight
 
It seems pure boxers are extremely prone to breaking their hands in a streetfight tho...

Happened to me as well when I was still just boxing(bone behind the pinkie). Knowing how to hit hard but no hand conditioning to deal with the impact of the punch is fucked up. Adrenaline takes away most of the pain, but not all.

Mix some agressive boxers skills with some, a lot of weighttraining, thai knees, enough wrestling skills to slam, basic standing submissions and enough ground control to do a g&p and the ability to go BERSERK
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in a streetfight and you've got one hell of a fighter.

Who needs defense if the other guy is being rushed and can't afford to take 1 clean punch to the face?
 
Ok,

I have observed that whenever we get the old Boxing vs MMA debate, MMA fans, in general, always resort to the "MMA fighter will destroy the boxer in a street fight because the boxer can't fight off his back" argument. Thus MMA is the superior fighting sport. Makes sense...??

First and foremost, I believe that this is a pointless debate to have, since both boxing and MMA are regulated sports with seperate sets of rules. Everyone may have a preference of one over the other, but to say that one sport is better, is your personal opinion, and the argument in reality should end there.

However, to declare that MMA is superior, because an MMA fighter has a better ground game then a boxer and thus would win a street fight is not a valid argument. When someone says "streetfight", this should indeed mean a streetfight, not, as is implied with the statement, merely an MMA fight that happens to be fought on paved street rather than in a ring or octagon.

A streetfight is just that, a streetfight. This does NOT mean that it is necessarily a one on one fight, man vs man. Does not mean that eye gouging, finger breaking, hair pulling, all of the above, are barred from the fight. It does not even mean that a gun or a knife won't be brought into the fight. What it does mean, is that it is an uncontrolled fight, between an unknown quantity of participants with unknown skillsets and/or weapons, with an unknown instigating factor, whether it be robbery, thuggery, gang violence, etc... Otherwise, as I said, it would simply be an MMA fight on pavement, in which case, yes, the MMA fighter wins.

That being said, I beileve that an elite boxer would be a preferable choice over an elite MMA fighter, as your "partner" if you were to engage in an actual streetfight, with the above unknown factors. An elite boxer, more so than an elite MMA fighter, has the ability to neutralise (KTFO) multiple combatants (most likely unskilled in a martial art) more quickly than the elite MMA fighter. Having an MMA fighter as a partner, you would stand a greater chance of that fighter being occupied with a single opponent and unable to assist, than a boxer that can unleash LETHAL (ungloved, yes) combinations faster than most thugs could throw a single punch. The boxer would likely have a greater ability to withstand trauma from a weapon such as a bat or pipe, as they are trained specifically for evasive defence, and in the absence of it effective blocking including tight chin tucking and upper body movement to nullify impacts. On the ground, the boxer is not considerably disadvantaged against a typical street thug. He should be stonger, far more endurance, and maintain ungloved knockout power from most positions on the ground.

When your partner is laying a killer armbar on a thug on the ground, it won't help you much as his 3 buddys continue advancing on you. A boxer can, and there are documented cases, quickly nullify street fight threats in a way that MMA fighters, in my opinion, would not.

I'll take a boxer with me to the streets anyday. Single Boxer vs MMA fighter, in an MMA fight on the street??? No contest... but that's not a streetfight.

Your scenario seems best suited for a one on one encounter, without unforseen problems. but if it is a streetfight as you say, you don't even need to be at the level of a pro boxer to completely outclass some ordinary Joe.

If you're talking about multiple opponents in a crowded room, I think it depends more on the person, than just the fighting style. Guys like David Tua, Mark Hunt, hell even Tank Abbott are going to have great success. These guys can not only put people to sleep with the first shot, they're massive and can move bodies around, are extremely durable, have powerful core muscles to keep stability, etc. There's no guarantee they'd all surive, but i'd rather have them on my side than some other fighters that are just built for one on one competition.
 
It seems pure boxers are extremely prone to breaking their hands in a streetfight tho...

Happened to me as well when I was still just boxing(bone behind the pinkie). Knowing how to hit hard but no hand conditioning to deal with the impact of the punch is fucked up. Adrenaline takes away most of the pain, but not all.

Mix some agressive boxers skills with some, a lot of weighttraining, thai knees, enough wrestling skills to slam,

Michael Katsidis is known for getting into street brawls, where he's crushed people's faces before his own hands. But for that matter, a Wrestler going for a shot, or a BJJ guy falling backwards is liable to crack their own skull. More than one guy in MMA has already hurt himself going for shots.
 
if an unknown mma guy and unknown boxer square off, i say the boxer wins; because most mma guys think they can strike and if they don't know the other guy is a boxer.. alot will assume he is just some clown who thinks he can box. Is that every occassion no, but i have seen two instances where mma guys got blasted out by a boxer, because they stood w/him not knowing he was a high level ex amateur (low/mid level pro). An all things being equal the boxer usually delivers and absorbs a better shot than the mma guy in my exp; in boxing u have to take abuse if u can't tech def/counter it, in mma u can shoot/throw or fall on ur back to guard when u don't wanna get hit.
 
another point is alot of boxers have been in street fights; an they are prepared to deal w/someone trying to take them down or tie them up. Its been happening their whole lives, noone really tries to throw hands w/them; because they are boxers, that is their expertise.

an finally as kabuki said a streetfight can't be gameplanned or prepared for, because you don't know what will happen as far as weapons or people involved; an u have no idea of your opp strength toughness craziness or whatnot.

i have seen wrestlers knock themselves out on shoots or slams against non trained guys; a wrestler and a bjj stylist i know got their asses handed to them when they got caught w/some hard shots early. They were so rocked they shot sloppy and got beaten into the ground; one guy was a collegiate wrestler, the bjj guy was a machado purple belt.

anything can happen in a streetfight, that is why its best not to be in them because u can't prepare yourself from the numerous factors that are apart of it. U can be a boxer who has no ground skills and kills everyone he faces; or u could be a bjj guy who gets his *ss kicked everytime it comes time to brawl.

statistics mean little..if u go from bouncer to bouncer..boxer to boxer..mmaer to mmaer u will hear diff things..if u got to diff people on this forum u will hear diff things; an that is us speaking from personal exp, not what we read in a book or heard from the gracies.

but one statistic is factual 100% of fights start standing up...
 
This question is just too difficult to debate because a boxer isn't going to rely soley on boxing skills in a street fight, and an MMA fighter isn't going to rely entirely on MMA skills.
 
Thanks guys for intelligent debate from all sides of the argument (including many in the "middle" !).

I'm glad to see that the real point of the thread was well taken... a staged MMA fight in Kimbo's backyard is not a streetfight !!
 
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