Are Indian wrestlers legit?

[ChickenBrother]

Well, definitely, I mean, the economic obstacles he had to deal with and the lack of government support are one of the reasons why I'm a fan of Sushi Kumar, other than just the fact that he has exciting matches. I think there are actually a number of Indian wrestlers involved in pelwanhi that might have the right stuff but just might not get discovered or have the necessary financial conditions or backing.

Anyway, there's nothing racist about anything you're saying and there ain't nothing racist about discussing the effects of a certain diet. I was thinking of certain other posts in this thread that got pretty ridiculous in my eyes. Although I was misstating things to say that the ridiculousness was merely owing to racist content; we've also got discussion of male on male rape, for example.

I wasn't familiar with Sushil Kumar but after looking him up, yeah he sounds like a true underdog story. Partially inspired to take up wrestling by his cousin, who had to stop competing because their family could only support one wrestler. Strict vegetarian. And turned down a $70K liquor commercial (when he's not making big money) because he didn't want to promote alcohol to young people. What a badass. But at almost 38, do you think he has a real chance to qualify for the Olympics?

The vegetarian angle is significant. I know it can be done but you must have to be super strict with your diet - just another inconvenience for an athlete when traveling. I tried to give up meat for a week just out of curiosity and after a few days said fuck that. Couldn't train with any kind of intensity and felt like crap. Respect to anyone that does it because the energy and recovery demands of training wrestling are massive, and by far the easiest way for most athletes to do that is to eat a balanced diet including meat.

By the way I didn't think you were accusing me of being racist, just wanted to clarify my post. Agree there's some offensive stuff in this thread and most threads about national origin sadly seem to devolve into that.

 

[winterbike]

I wasn't familiar with Sushil Kumar but after looking him up, yeah he sounds like a true underdog story. Partially inspired to take up wrestling by his cousin, who had to stop competing because their family could only support one wrestler. Strict vegetarian. And turned down a $70K liquor commercial (when he's not making big money) because he didn't want to promote alcohol to young people. What a badass. But at almost 38, do you think he has a real chance to qualify for the Olympics?

The vegetarian angle is significant. I know it can be done but you must have to be super strict with your diet - just another inconvenience for an athlete when traveling. I tried to give up meat for a week just out of curiosity and after a few days said fuck that. Couldn't train with any kind of intensity and felt like crap. Respect to anyone that does it because the energy and recovery demands of training wrestling are massive, and by far the easiest way for most athletes to do that is to eat a balanced diet including meat.

By the way I didn't think you were accusing me of being racist, just wanted to clarify my post. Agree there's some offensive stuff in this thread and most threads about national origin sadly seem to devolve into that.

There are a few videos out there about a village in India full of guys who train all day to be bouncers. They boast about a ''strict vegetarian diet'', and, despite being in pretty good shape, most of them carry a significant amount of body fat (even the skinny ones). It's a big handicap for sure.

 

[Kforcer]

I wasn't familiar with Sushil Kumar but after looking him up, yeah he sounds like a true underdog story. Partially inspired to take up wrestling by his cousin, who had to stop competing because their family could only support one wrestler. Strict vegetarian. And turned down a $70K liquor commercial (when he's not making big money) because he didn't want to promote alcohol to young people. What a badass. But at almost 38, do you think he has a real chance to qualify for the Olympics?

The vegetarian angle is significant. I know it can be done but you must have to be super strict with your diet - just another inconvenience for an athlete when traveling. I tried to give up meat for a week just out of curiosity and after a few days said fuck that. Couldn't train with any kind of intensity and felt like crap. Respect to anyone that does it because the energy and recovery demands of training wrestling are massive, and by far the easiest way for most athletes to do that is to eat a balanced diet including meat.

By the way I didn't think you were accusing me of being racist, just wanted to clarify my post. Agree there's some offensive stuff in this thread and most threads about national origin sadly seem to devolve into that.

As far as Kumar, I don't know if he's gonna make it, but I'm definitely pulling for him. It also seems like it wasn't entirely fair that he wasn't picked in the last Olympics and he wasn't beaten in a wrestle-off for the spot, but simply not selected. If I recall, they didn't take him even when the guy they did select for his spot was somehow disqualified from competition though. But I would just like to see him overcome all of that. It'd be a great story. Definitely would be tough though, there's no doubt about that.

That's interesting about vegetarianism. Is whey off limits for vegetarians, or just for vegans? Because if you can't eat meat or ingest whey protein, that seems like it would definitely be tough on your muscles. I would never try it myself, well, unless it turned out it was going to save my life or something. What about vegetable-based protein powders...? Is the consensus that they are, relatively speaking, ineffectual compared to animal-based protein? I've tried vegetable protein and basically didn't "feel" like it had the same effect as whey, but that's obviously pretty subjective and I didn't try it to the exclusion of meat or anything like that.

 

[ChickenBrother]

There are a few videos out there about a village in India full of guys who train all day to be bouncers. They boast about a ''strict vegetarian diet'', and, despite being in pretty good shape, most of them carry a significant amount of body fat (even the skinny ones). It's a big handicap for sure.

As far as Kumar, I don't know if he's gonna make it, but I'm definitely pulling for him. It also seems like it wasn't entirely fair that he wasn't picked in the last Olympics and he wasn't beaten in a wrestle-off for the spot, but simply not selected. If I recall, they didn't take him even when the guy they did select for his spot was somehow disqualified from competition though. But I would just like to see him overcome all of that. It'd be a great story. Definitely would be tough though, there's no doubt about that.

That's interesting about vegetarianism. Is whey off limits for vegetarians, or just for vegans? Because if you can't eat meat or ingest whey protein, that seems like it would definitely be tough on your muscles. I would never try it myself, well, unless it turned out it was going to save my life or something. What about vegetable-based protein powders...? Is the consensus that they are, relatively speaking, ineffectual compared to animal-based protein? I've tried vegetable protein and basically didn't "feel" like it had the same effect as whey, but that's obviously pretty subjective and I didn't try it to the exclusion of meat or anything like that.

I think most people don't realize how much protein and calories in their diet actually comes from meat. From my (very brief) experience and from talking to athletes who've gone vegetarian long-term, you have to basically gorge yourself on carbs, nuts, beans and dairy just to maintain the weight and muscle mass you've built from training on a meat diet. And even then you'll probably lose weight.

A young fighter in my gym who went vegetarian for health reasons shortly before turning pro told me the initial feeling of weakness (which I can attest to) comes from vitamin B12 deficiency, and that it takes a few months for your body to adjust but that it does get better. He's always looked pretty lean - lanky with muscle mass but not particularly jacked, kind of like Jon Jones. I don't know if he's typical for a vegetarian fighter but he's an excellent athlete and will probably make it to the UFC in the next few years.

Re. vegetarianism, I'm no expert but I know there are "levels to this shit." Some include dairy and eggs, others not. Re. Hindus who are vegetarian, I understand that most include dairy. I'm not Indian but have worked with many Indian Americans and Indian Brits living in the U.S. and the UK over the years. For the record, I'm told that vegetarianism isn't a strict Hindu requirement but that it is "highly encouraged." Confirmed figures of strict vegetarians in India are controversial but tends to shake out around 30% of the population. However, it's posited that an even larger % of the population that does eat meat only does so rarely. Beef is always off limits for observant Hindus and 80% of India's population is Hindu.

 

[nefti]

Gama was a Muslim but he was Indian still. During the partition I believe he defended alot of Hindu families that were caught up in the Indo-Pak fighting although he eventually moved to settle in Pakistan.

Also I don't think Muslims have a color bias, Arabs always looked pretty brown to me.

Maybe Khabib would rape you though if you ask him since male on male action seems to be your thing.

Lol not likely, he would not help kafirs/infidels.

 

[winterbike]

That's interesting about vegetarianism. Is whey off limits for vegetarians, or just for vegans? Because if you can't eat meat or ingest whey protein, that seems like it would definitely be tough on your muscles. I would never try it myself, well, unless it turned out it was going to save my life or something. What about vegetable-based protein powders...? Is the consensus that they are, relatively speaking, ineffectual compared to animal-based protein? I've tried vegetable protein and basically didn't "feel" like it had the same effect as whey, but that's obviously pretty subjective and I didn't try it to the exclusion of meat or anything like that.

Whey should work okay.

Recent studies seem to indicate plant proteins don't protect as much against the effects of aging and maintain bone mass in healthy adults. I've also seen a recent one where eating a good amount of soy protein impaired strength gains (as opposed to equal amounts of animal protein).

Plant proteins are fine to eat for the average person I guess, and are ok if you don't want to starve, but are sub-par compared to animal proteins.

 

[winterbike]

A young fighter in my gym who went vegetarian for health reasons shortly before turning pro told me the initial feeling of weakness (which I can attest to) comes from vitamin B12 deficiency, and that it takes a few months for your body to adjust but that it does get better. He's always looked pretty lean - lanky with muscle mass but not particularly jacked, kind of like Jon Jones. I don't know if he's typical for a vegetarian fighter but he's an excellent athlete and will probably make it to the UFC in the next few years.

I hope for his sake he supplements B12, because that's a bogus statement.

 

[Bluesbreaker]

That's exactly what this thread was missing, some nutritional bro science.

 

[Viper2]

Anytime a thread is made complimenting Indian athletes, immediately the incredibly insecure racist white guys arrive and start their trolling. Happens every time without fail. The main reason for this is because Indian Americans are the highest earning ethnic group in the USA, and this infuriates these racist white guys, so they take out their frustration online by trolling Indians. A secondary reason for this trolling is because many male Indian Americans date and/or marry white women and this further infuriates these racist white male online trolls.

 

[winterbike]

Anytime a thread is made complimenting Indian athletes, immediately the incredibly insecure racist white guys arrive and start their trolling. Happens every time without fail. The main reason for this is because Indian Americans are the highest earning ethnic group in the USA, and this infuriates these racist white guys, so they take out their frustration online by trolling Indians. A secondary reason for this trolling is because many male Indian Americans date and/or marry white women and this further infuriates these racist white male online trolls.

 

[winterbike]

Anytime a thread is made complimenting Indian athletes, immediately the incredibly insecure racist white guys arrive and start their trolling. Happens every time without fail. The main reason for this is because Indian Americans are the highest earning ethnic group in the USA, and this infuriates these racist white guys, so they take out their frustration online by trolling Indians. A secondary reason for this trolling is because many male Indian Americans date and/or marry white women and this further infuriates these racist white male online trolls.

Ignoring your weird hate-filled rant, have you considered that maybe the answer to OP's question could be a legitimate ''no''? ''Is the Peruvian space program legit?'' would yield the same answer, it doesn't mean people hate Peruvians.

 

[TheMaster]

Whey should work okay.

Recent studies seem to indicate plant proteins don't protect as much against the effects of aging and maintain bone mass in healthy adults. I've also seen a recent one where eating a good amount of soy protein impaired strength gains (as opposed to equal amounts of animal protein).

Plant proteins are fine to eat for the average person I guess, and are ok if you don't want to starve, but are sub-par compared to animal proteins.

Not sure about this. I like meat as much as the next guy but I think it's necessity for strength is overrated.

Nuts are probably the best protein source out there and in no way inferior to meat.

If we use the Great Gama example he did eat meat but his primary protein source was a pound and a half of crushed almond paste everyday along with milk.

I've also personally noticed the biggest gains I made in muscle were consuming alot of raw nuts.

There's also this study which strongly supports nuts over meat protein for health.

https://awellfedworld.org/issues/health/nuts-vs-meat/

"The study found that people who consumed large amounts of meat protein experienced a 60-percent increase in cardiovascular disease, while people who consumed large amounts of protein from nuts and seeds experienced a 40-percent reduction in cardiovascular disease."

 

[ChickenBrother]

I hope for his sake he supplements B12, because that's a bogus statement.

He said he supplemented in the beginning but found it wasn't needed after a few months. I think he had been vegetarian for about 3 years when I asked him about it and said he started voluntarily around age 19. Said he really missed burgers for the first year or so but didn't any more. More power to him because the guy trains full time as a pro fighter and will probably be in one of the major orgs soon if he doesn't burn out.

All I know is that if I don't eat meat for more than a day or two, I feel like shit and struggle with a hard training session. I know a vegetarian diet is supposed to be healthier in general, but it's not for me.

 

[updowniri]

So India either doesn't have many wrestlers, doesn't have good coaching or doesn't do things the right way? Quite possibly all of those? Considering this, and going back to OP's question, I think it'd be fair to say India doesn't rank very high in terms of ''wrestling legitness''.

In mens freestyle wrestling, which is closest to their traditional style, they were ranked sixth in total points (basic summation of medal and placing values) in last years world championship. Also Kazakhstan is ranked way to high, they hosted the tournament and many suspect made an unfair bracket. All their wrestlers that got the finals got teched. India is worse then Russia, USA, Iran, and Georgia, all major wrestling power houses. When you think about how different traditional Indian wrestling is to freestyle wrestling, wrestling on mud with no time limit. How the government does not have as lucrative an olympic training program as other countries, and how wrestling is a niche thing in India that is not being enjoyed by their billions. Then is is clear that, while not the best wrestlers in the world, Indian wrestling is plenty legit.

 

[updowniri]

Ignoring your weird hate-filled rant, have you considered that maybe the answer to OP's question could be a legitimate ''no''? ''Is the Peruvian space program legit?'' would yield the same answer, it doesn't mean people hate Peruvians.

Probably not considering they consistently field medalists every year at major international level competition. Something that is very difficult to do. Wrestling is not some bs niche sport that any country can sporadically win a medal in. Olympic and world medalists come from high level training programs, no exceptions.
Also population is irrelevant, India has more ethnic, language, and cultural divisions then any other country in the world. Its not a homogeneous area where everyone has access to the same things. Indian mud wrestling clubs are probably in a specific region and attended to by a specific caste, tribe, village or whatever. That is the population of wrestlers they are fielding.

 

[Viper2]

Of course Indian wrestlers are very legit. However, don't expect the racist male white trolls on Sherdog to ever admit it, because they won't.

 

[winterbike]

Of course Indian wrestlers are very legit. However, don't expect the racist male white trolls on Sherdog to ever admit it, because they won't.

You drank too much SJW kool-aid buddy.

 

[JohnPJones]

Theres been talk that MMA is getting very popular in India region, pakistan too. Guessing its because Khabibs popularity? Or Maybe all the events One Fc keeps doing in Asia.

I know they have a traditional wrestling called Kushti which is competed outdoors in a muddy area. Does India have a strong martial arts history outside of wrestling like striking arts?

How fast can they be competitive in UFC if they already have some wrestling history?

Seen a bunch of pics and alot of them are jacked

Supposedly all Asian martial arts come from india...supposedly

 

[Viper2]

You drank too much SJW kool-aid buddy.

Stay racist and jelly buddy.

 

[winterbike]

Stay racist and jelly buddy.

Of what? India's objectively terrible record in athletic competitions? They have 28 Olympic medals total, ever. That's the same as Latvia, a country no one knows about with a 2M population. Or that one stoner dude, Michael Phelps. It's also half of North Korea's medal count.

I do have been corrected on their recent performances in the wrestling world championships though, 6th place in freestyle is good.