Does anyone butt scoot anymore? How to beat the BS 101

[-guerilla-]

Yep, there are more than a few guard specialists in MMA. More than the "danger" of being on the bottom, the current scoring of MMA makes it less used - in Japanese MMA it was pretty common for guys to win from the bottom using elbow strikes and threatening subs.

The guard is getting less and less relavent as athletes learn they can just stand up and walk away

I train athletes to stand up, walk away, put their hands up and dance around like rocky...the butt scooter is embarrassed and will stand up...plus everybody in the crowd knows whos winning and will boo the scooter (easy round)

Especially if you throw a few hard shots 1st

 

[rmongler]

Yep, there are more than a few guard specialists in MMA. More than the "danger" of being on the bottom, the current scoring of MMA makes it less used - in Japanese MMA it was pretty common for guys to win from the bottom using elbow strikes and threatening subs.

In the early days of Japanese MMA it was pretty common for there to be significant disparities and mismatches between the capabilities of two fighters in a fight.

As the levels of competition become greater, and differences between competitors at the highest levels become smaller, you start to see more optimal strategies play out.

 

[Deleted member 512089]

I like how you think TS. I watched the French no go championship 2 days ago and the butt scouting was so omnipresent and quite frankly ridiculous. It's not a combat sport anymore than dancing. I get it we have rules to compete etc. but it's supposed to be a martial art. Butt scouting is sooo far away from real combat situation it's embarrassing. I'm not saying we should emulate self defense but some rules to make it more a combat sport again than a game and to make it more appealing to the casual are badly needed.

 

[-guerilla-]

I like how you think TS. I watch the French no hi championship 2 days ago and the butt scouting was so omnipresent and quite frankly ridiculous. It's not a combat sport anymore than dancing. I get it we have rules to compete etc. but it's supposed to be a martial art. Butt scouting is sooo far away from real combat situation it's embarrassing. I'm not saying we should emulate self defense but some rules to make it more a combat sport again than a game and to make it more appealing to the casual are badly needed.

I hate the commercialization of sports more than any man walking but we have to accept it as a reality in today's world

unless the sport is viable for television audiences it doesn't have a shot at survival

The butt scoot is definitely something that destroys bjjs television appeal and it's viability for real fight utility

Just show some chick at BJJ MATCH and she will giggle Non-Stop until she has to go piss

The fact is you have to Layman test these things and if layman think what you're doing looks stupid it probably does!

 

[-guerilla-]

In the early days of Japanese MMA it was pretty common for there to be significant disparities and mismatches between the capabilities of two fighters in a fight.

As the levels of competition become greater, and differences between competitors at the highest levels become smaller, you start to see more optimal strategies play out.

I swear it's more simple than that

people who are trained in classical grappling Sports stay down there and play guard and every now and then get submitted while they're trying to Wade through the downed opponents legs

You don't have to.. you can just stand up and walk away from that silly crap

The sport has evolved and people have discovered they don't have to try to Wade through somebody's guard...they can just stand up and walk away and that's what they're doing

I personally subscribe to the sakuraba approach

stand up and drop bombs down on your opponent and make it clear to the entire audience who is whipping who

I swear the smartest strategy is just to break the guard stand up and put your hands up

The butt scooter will be forced to stand up while being booed and be returned to the mat once again under your control

everybody knows who's winning at that point

Especially the layman

 

[Deleted member 512089]

I think one of the solution is to not train grappling arts separately. Not focusing on only throws or only ground.

Like training bjj + judo or no gi + wrestling. Most guys that I saw cross training in wrestling and bjj never butt scoot ever.

I don't know enough about it but catch wrestling seems to have the right mentality about that isn't it ? Is there any butt scoot in it ?

 

[-guerilla-]

I think one of the solution is to not train grappling arts separately. Not focusing on only throws or only ground.

Like training bjj + judo or no gi + wrestling. Most guys that I saw cross training in wrestling and bjj never butt scoot ever.

I don't know enough about it but catch wrestling seems to have the right mentality about that isn't it ? Is there any butt scoot in it ?

I think some athletes don't do it because they don't want to destroy their real fight skills with what is unfortunately a very effective tactic in sport BJJ

I never butt scoot because I don't want to have all my teeth kicked in

a real fight situation or MMA is what i train for so I learn to fight a different way

people who try to bring sport BJJ to MMA clubs are never surprised what they're doing doesn't really work in real world senarios

they know that...they just chose to dedicate themselves to sport BJJ cuz they didn't want to get punched in the face at training

 

[Deleted member 512089]

I think some athletes don't do it because they don't want to destroy their real fight skills with what is unfortunately a very effective tactic in sport BJJ

I never butt scoot because I don't want to have all my teeth kicked in

a real fight situation or MMA is what i train for so I learn to fight a different way

people who try to bring sport BJJ to MMA clubs are never surprised what they're doing doesn't really work in real world senarios

they know that...they just chose to dedicate themselves to sport BJJ cuz they didn't want to get punched in the face at training

You know anything about the catch wrestling mentality ? Curious to know

 

[-guerilla-]

You know anything about the catch wrestling mentality ? Curious to know

I am primarily a catch wrestler

I have done very little in the way of organized grappling sports, just a few years of judo wrestling and sumo

Few hundred hours or bjj open mat

Otherwise its all been catch as catch can for MMA

I never used twisting head cranks or small joint however...thats street survival

Everything else is game

 

[aunshi189]

Even though he lost, I did enjoy Faber dealing with Nicky Ryan's butt scooting at Polaris 10.

 

[Stujitsu1]

Its ridiculous to let people pull Gard
(put themselves in a MMA pounding position) and not lose points

I agree, I think points should be for dominant position only and being on top, even in guard is one point. This will encourage fighting for takedowns. It would essentially make a takedown worth 1 point. Which makes sense in bjj...it worth something but not much. If you sweep and land in guard-top also just one point. If I sweep to mount 3 points. If I get taken down then sweep, but my opponent establishes a guard, we are tied...we should be! We both accomplished the same thing.

 

[Stujitsu1]

The guard is getting less and less relavent as athletes learn they can just stand up and walk away

I train athletes to stand up, walk away, put their hands up and dance around like rocky...the butt scooter is embarrassed and will stand up...plus everybody in the crowd knows whos winning and will boo the scooter (easy round)

Especially if you throw a few hard shots 1st

I agree in spirit at least. The guard in the sense of blocking the worse side control and mount is useful but to stay there is just non-essential. You could make a career out of standing up and getting guiillotines and back-takes off a front headlock if you wanted. Might even be higher percentage!

 

[-guerilla-]

If you DONT penalize guard pulling and butt flopping/scooting with takedown points your sport starts looking like full contact paddy cake competition

Nobody will get into this but HARDCORE fanboys

 

[yetanother]

If you DONT penalize guard pulling and butt flopping/scooting with takedown points your sport starts looking like full contact paddy cake competition

Nobody will get into this but HARDCORE fanboys

Why are you complaining about the rules of a sport you don't train. IMHO if you refuse to attack the butt scooter in MMA you should be immediately dq'ed for being a bitch (but kicking and stomping him should be allowed)

 

[Deleted member 512089]

Why are you complaining about the rules of a sport you don't train. IMHO if you refuse to attack the butt scooter in MMA you should be immediately dq'ed for being a bitch (but kicking and stomping him should be allowed)

He's talking about grappling. We all know that butt scooting is a 100% losing tactic in MMA. And besides the butt scooter is the one who refuses to engage on the feet and work for the takedown. Anyway not effective in MMA. When was last time it was used ? Was it overeem Vs werdum in strikeforce ?

 

[peregrine]

I love how every goal of guerillas is to make it to the olympics or tv.

Btw butt scooting is LAME

 

[yetanother]

He's talking about grappling. We all know that butt scooting is a 100% losing tactic in MMA. And besides the butt scooter is the one who refuses to engage on the feet and work for the takedown. Anyway not effective in MMA. When was last time it was used ? Was it overeem Vs werdum in strikeforce ?

You get stood up when you butt scoot. Seems like a bad tactic too.

 

[yetanother]

I love how every goal of guerillas is to make it to the olympics or tv.

Btw butt scooting is LAME

He perceives the world as a fat wrestler.
He loves push outs and bellying out in freestyle.
He hates stalling calls, weight classes, being ridden when he turtles and fancy guard work.

 

[RJ Green]

I love how every goal of guerillas is to make it to the olympics or tv.

Btw butt scooting is LAME

up until Ronda i'd never met anybody who came in to train because they saw cool Judo on TV, and now that she's retired it's been a while since her name's come up. Never heard a *normie* say Kayla's name despite the fact that she's won two gold medals.

i also encourage people who iwant to see more/any Judo on TV to try and sit through an entire IJF stream...i've been doing this for 15 years, referee, and i'd just as soon watch the mat highlights.

the IJF's streaming site is fantastic. you can click through different matches and they'll have the scores timestamped for you. you'd think they'd really start to push the ease of access and relative ubiquity of the internet, but boomers love their TV.

 

[-guerilla-]