Does unfiltered coffee (French press) increase LDL?

[RemyR]

I keep hearing that it does but also heard multiple times dietary cholesterol has little impact on LDL.

 

[yekmurat]

I dont know about ldl but Without caffeine brain and body feels much much better

 

[RemyR]

I dont know about ldl but Without caffeine brain and body feels much much better

I prefer a cup in the morning. I stopped drinking for 2 months and my energy curve felt smoother but overall felt like i can get more done with 1 cup in the morning. Nothing crazy.

 

[Volador]

I dont know about ldl but Without caffeine brain and body feels much much better

Please stop repeating this BS lol. It makes no sense.

 

[shunyata]

There are some lipids in coffee beans, but the total amount of lipids you're consuming with black coffee is pretty low compared to the fat in a meal.

Now if you're putting a bunch of cream(er) or you're one of those nuts adding butter or coconut oil the coffee...

Then yeah you're adding more fat/oil to it.

But the amount of lipids in black coffee that has not been filtered is pretty low.



That being said, if your LDL is actually higher than it should be the biggest thing would be increase overall fiber in your diet and cut back on sugars and saturated fats.

It's downright comical how many people I've seen SUDDENLY develop high cholesterol after 6 months on the bulletproof coffee fad.

Coconut oil is great, but it's practically vegan lard.

 

[monkeyrhythm]

There are some lipids in coffee beans, but the total amount of lipids you're consuming with black coffee is pretty low compared to the fat in a meal.

Now if you're putting a bunch of cream(er) or you're one of those nuts adding butter or coconut oil the coffee...

Then yeah you're adding more fat/oil to it.

But the amount of lipids in black coffee that has not been filtered is pretty low.



That being said, if your LDL is actually higher than it should be the biggest thing would be increase overall fiber in your diet and cut back on sugars and saturated fats.

It's downright comical how many people I've seen SUDDENLY develop high cholesterol after 6 months on the bulletproof coffee fad.

Coconut oil is great, but it's practically vegan lard.

What is "high" (as in detrimental) cholesterol though? There's a line of thinking which is starting to be borne out by research that the average size of an individuals LDL particles is just as (if not more) important than their total cholesterol and/or their LDL to HDL ratio.

Lard and coconut oil can both be great, if from the 'right' source, and in context of an individual's wider diet and lifestyle.

 

[shunyata]

What is "high" (as in detrimental) cholesterol though? There's a line of thinking which is starting to be borne out by research that the average size of an individuals LDL particles is just as (if not more) important than their total cholesterol and/or their LDL to HDL ratio.

Lard and coconut oil can both be great, if from the 'right' source, and in context of an individual's wider diet and lifestyle.

There are clinical guidelines, but as always in nature it gets fuzzier. There are observed populations with a genetic predisposition towards high hdl and ldl but who eat a diet high in fiber and fish but low in saturated fat who appear to be healthy despite the high total counts. However those populations tend to have a reasonable HDL/LDL ratio.

From a dietary perspective it seems like balance matters a great deal, and while I love things cooked in pork fat and / or coconut, both of those can be overdone. Sourcing matters, but so does dosage and context for those lipids.

 

[monkeyrhythm]

There are clinical guidelines, but as always in nature it gets fuzzier. There are observed populations with a genetic predisposition towards high hdl and ldl but who eat a diet high in fiber and fish but low in saturated fat who appear to be healthy despite the high total counts. However those populations tend to have a reasonable HDL/LDL ratio.

From a dietary perspective it seems like balance matters a great deal, and while I love things cooked in pork fat and / or coconut, both of those can be overdone. Sourcing matters, but so does dosage and context for those lipids.

The reason I mentioned sourcing is that with monogastric animals like pigs they "are what they eat" is much more true than with ruminants e.g. the fat of grain fed swine will typically have higher levels of PUFA's like linoleic acid than those fed with a mixed diet.

Also, yes there are clinical guidelines but that doesn't mean we understand what is optimal. It may well be that 'high' levels of LDL where the LDL particles are large/fluffy is indicative of good health, not poor.

 

[ShariTaho]

Never hear of any proof of that method

 

[forum poster]

There's a subset of people whos LDL is affected by French press. Not sure of the percentage but I think it is rather low.

What is "high" (as in detrimental) cholesterol though? There's a line of thinking which is starting to be borne out by research that the average size of an individuals LDL particles is just as (if not more) important than their total cholesterol and/or their LDL to HDL ratio.

Nah that's not true. The only people that say that are bloggers and supplement salesmen. It's more likely that larger LDL particles are even more atherogenic.

 

[monkeyrhythm]

Nah that's not true. The only people that say that are bloggers and supplement salesmen. It's more likely that larger LDL particles are even more atherogenic.

Don't forget the Doctors and Research Scientists saying it too. This article published in the British Medical Journal references a number of relevant studies:
https://www.ndph.ox.ac.uk/files/forms/malhotra-paper.pdf
Can you reference any sources to support the position that "It's more likely that larger LDL particles are even more atherogenic"?

 

[forum poster]

Don't forget the Doctors and Research Scientists saying it too. This article published in the British Medical Journal references a number of relevant studies:
https://www.ndph.ox.ac.uk/files/forms/malhotra-paper.pdf
Can you reference any sources to support the position that "It's more likely that larger LDL particles are even more atherogenic"?

It was never accepted to begin with. These new biomarkers are relatively novel and are more so used for patients with metabolic syndrome, diabetes, and other genetic heart disease risk factors.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/16765964/
There's little difference between the sizes of pattern A and pattern B. LDL-p and ApoB are probably better indicators if their numbers are discordent. Both are potentially atherogenic, both well small enough to enter the endothelium. People with hypercholesteremia tend to have subtype A particles and can still die extremely young of heart disease.

 

[monkeyrhythm]

It was never accepted to begin with. These new biomarkers are relatively novel and are more so used for patients with metabolic syndrome, diabetes, and other genetic heart disease risk factors.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/16765964/
There's little difference between the sizes of pattern A and pattern B. LDL-p and ApoB are probably better indicators if their numbers are discordent. Both are potentially atherogenic, both well small enough to enter the endothelium. People with hypercholesteremia tend to have subtype A particles and can still die extremely young of heart disease.

The study you've referenced uses carotid intima-media thickness as a measure for atherosclerotic risk - this is not recommended by either the American Heart Association or European guidelines for the clinical evaluation of cardiovascular disease risk.
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(19)30343-5/fulltext

My point is simply that we still have much to learn, and we are certainly not at a point where this can be spoken about with certainty.

 

[TeTe]

I only make coffee with a French Press. But that's only because it tastes way better than drip coffee from a coffeemaker.

 

[forum poster]

The study you've referenced uses carotid intima-media thickness as a measure for atherosclerotic risk - this is not recommended by either the American Heart Association or European guidelines for the clinical evaluation of cardiovascular disease risk.
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(19)30343-5/fulltext

My point is simply that we still have much to learn, and we are certainly not at a point where this can be spoken about with certainty.

"Atherosclerotic risk". For the most part, that is carotid IMT. As Athleroscloris is one of the main drivers of it.
Not the best predictors for Acute heart failure for sure It's basically at the end point of life. It's an extreme end point and when you're dealing with a subset of people who have had, let's say "not the best heart healthy diets", it's Acute heart failure is the end stage of the disease, where a whole lifetime of plaque has accumulated, that's the point when you're knocking on heaven's door.

 

[forum poster]

The study you've referenced uses carotid intima-media thickness as a measure for atherosclerotic risk - this is not recommended by either the American Heart Association or European guidelines for the clinical evaluation of cardiovascular disease risk.
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(19)30343-5/fulltext

My point is simply that we still have much to learn, and we are certainly not at a point where this can be spoken about with certainty.

I suspect you might be into low-carb. If so, Id point you to a low-carber like Attia. Even this guy who literallly shills for Taubes and low carb doesn't agree that LDL paricle size matters. https://peterattiamd.com/the-straight-dope-on-cholesterol-part-vii/

 

[monkeyrhythm]

I suspect you might be into low-carb. If so, Id point you to a low-carber like Attia. Even this guy who literallly shills for Taubes and low carb doesn't agree that LDL paricle size matters. https://peterattiamd.com/the-straight-dope-on-cholesterol-part-vii/

But you said earlier that "It's more likely that larger LDL particles are even more atherogenic"? I can't find anything to support that?

This later article from Attia stressing the importance of apoB includes some interesting nuggets on LDL particle size (alluded to by a discordance between LDL-P in relation to LDL-C when it comes to various risk measures/predictions):
https://peterattiamd.com/measuring-cardiovascular-disease-risk-and-the-importance-of-apob-part-1/