lomachenkos style in mma

[Ilk]

I said there are boxers who could do it if they trained for it. With the possible exception of guys like Lomachenko who already have a grappling background, it would take a few years not a single camp.

I'm not referencing any specific guy who has tried in the past. I'm saying that the best fighter alive right now is the guy who would most likely win a nhb fight right now. That person is the top MMA fighter, not the top boxer.

Lmao. You sure someone heavy like Ruiz, Joshua, Wilder would not knock out ppl in a hit? I am not into MT but are you sure the top heavy weight MT guy is not going to murder ppl with a single low kick??? I dont know about you but DC as a heavy weight champ does not struck me as someone that is bad ass fighter...he is rather clumsy and unathleti. Sure Ruiz is too but he aint clumsy. And looking at MMA heavy weights... besides DC is anyone good at anything... like really? DC has perhaps a top level wrestling and it ends there... nothing even average afterwards. You MMA guys are seriously brainwashed almost as much as TMA guys.

I just saw Zamedov is a current heavy weight in MT. I have seen him fight in KB and he has a good win against Badr Hari. Checked his MMA record as well, he is 2-0 with 2 KOs. Are you still sure MMA fighters are the baddest man alive?

Wasnt Adesanya a pro boxer with a meh career. Pretty good career in KB, but was he really a top level? Like Loma is in boxing? And now unbeaten in MMA? What is it 17-0 with 13 KOs... and he is not even a top striker. Just a very good striker in his prime.

You need to realise there have not been really top strikers in MMA in their prime. Someone like Loma will perhaps steam roll trough 2 divisions unless he meets a good kicker that is able to keep him at check and survive long enough to defuse the footwork of loma with low kicks. We have seen plenty of good boxers try fighting kick boxers and it just doesnt work well for the boxers. But I have my doubts MMA organizations have good kick boxers or MT guys.

 

[Reyesnuthugr]

I said there are boxers who could do it if they trained for it. With the possible exception of guys like Lomachenko who already have a grappling background, it would take a few years not a single camp.

I'm not referencing any specific guy who has tried in the past. I'm saying that the best fighter alive right now is the guy who would most likely win a nhb fight right now. That person is the top MMA fighter, not the top boxer.

What exactly does he need YEARS to prepare for? He already has the most difficult parts of MMA under his belt and in better order than the top MMA guys. There's wrestlers with less skill and little to no striking ability that have come in and done great with a wrestling base alone. You're just being absurd now.

 

[Based and White Pilled]

You need to realise there have not been really top strikers in MMA in their prime. Someone like Loma will perhaps steam roll trough 2 divisions unless he meets a good kicker that is able to keep him at check and survive long enough to defuse the footwork of loma with low kicks. We have seen plenty of good boxers try fighting kick boxers and it just doesnt work well for the boxers. But I have my doubts MMA organizations have good kick boxers or MT guys.

There have been at least four K1 World Grand Prix champions who competed in MMA in their primes on more than a part time basis. None of them was ever #1 in the world in MMA.

Mark Hunt
Semmy Schilt
Mirko Filipovic
Alistair Overeem

No, they were not "murdering dudes with a single low kick".

Your whole premise that we've never seen a truly elite striker in MMA is shit.

You've shown your ignorance.

 

[Based and White Pilled]

There's wrestlers with less skill and little to no striking ability that have come in and done great with a wrestling base alone.

Guys who are worse wrestlers than Loma have done great with wrestling alone?

 

[AndyMaBobs]

Nope not really. You do realise that most fighters would not switch to MMA due to their limited pay. We have already seen some pretty good kick boxers turn to MMA and do reasonably well. In reality world wide boxing draws the biggest talent pool of fighters due to pay and popularity. We will know only if MMA fighters are best once the organizations are able to pull to boxers, MT and kick boxers in their prime.

They don't do reasonably well because of just their kickboxing though, they do well because of their ability to stay off the ground.

No ground game = you lose. Sprawling itself isn't the hardest thing to learn, but it's more than sprawling, it's the defensive wrestling. A guy like Robert Whittaker is such an outstanding wrestler he can shrug off Yoel Romero, conversely there have been MMA fighters who have been wrestling all their careers that Yoel took down with ease.

 

[AndyMaBobs]

There have been at least four K1 World Grand Prix champions who competed in MMA in their primes on more than a part time basis. None of them was ever #1 in the world in MMA.

Mark Hunt
Semmy Schilt
Mirko Filipovic
Alistair Overeem

No, they were not "murdering dudes with a single low kick".

Your whole premise that we've never seen a truly elite striker in MMA is shit.

You've shown your ignorance.

Worth mentioning that Semmy and Overeem were MMA fighters first. Semmy transitioned and became the best kickboxer in heavyweight history, Overeem had his first experiences training and fighting in kickboxing, but was mostly an MMA fighter.

 

[AndyMaBobs]

Lmao. You sure someone heavy like Ruiz, Joshua, Wilder would not knock out ppl in a hit? I am not into MT but are you sure the top heavy weight MT guy is not going to murder ppl with a single low kick??? I dont know about you but DC as a heavy weight champ does not struck me as someone that is bad ass fighter...he is rather clumsy and unathleti. Sure Ruiz is too but he aint clumsy. And looking at MMA heavy weights... besides DC is anyone good at anything... like really? DC has perhaps a top level wrestling and it ends there... nothing even average afterwards. You MMA guys are seriously brainwashed almost as much as TMA guys.

I just saw Zamedov is a current heavy weight in MT. I have seen him fight in KB and he has a good win against Badr Hari. Checked his MMA record as well, he is 2-0 with 2 KOs. Are you still sure MMA fighters are the baddest man alive?

Wasnt Adesanya a pro boxer with a meh career. Pretty good career in KB, but was he really a top level? Like Loma is in boxing? And now unbeaten in MMA? What is it 17-0 with 13 KOs... and he is not even a top striker. Just a very good striker in his prime.

You need to realise there have not been really top strikers in MMA in their prime. Someone like Loma will perhaps steam roll trough 2 divisions unless he meets a good kicker that is able to keep him at check and survive long enough to defuse the footwork of loma with low kicks. We have seen plenty of good boxers try fighting kick boxers and it just doesnt work well for the boxers. But I have my doubts MMA organizations have good kick boxers or MT guys.

This fight may be relevant to the discussion.

 

[Ilk]

This fight may be relevant to the discussion.

This is what I was saying as well. There is pretty much bigger chance a guy like Loma is finished like that than losing by being taken down. I really doubt there are skilled enough wrestlers to catch him. But leg kicks and a huge ring are something he will strugle with.

By the way always wondered why boxers in KB wouldnt just push forward and try to KO the kickboxers ASAP in such bouts. Just pressure and try to end it fast. Do you have an example of a boxer winning a KB match vs a kick boxer?

 

[Reyesnuthugr]

This is what I was saying as well. There is pretty much bigger chance a guy like Loma is finished like that than losing by being taken down. I really doubt there are skilled enough wrestlers to catch him. But leg kicks and a huge ring are something he will strugle with.

He would do great in a large ring, he loves to use space. He also uses primarily offensive angles (with defense built in-- angles that escape AND setup nasty counters in the same moment) so he doesn't rely too hard on needing the extra space, but the extra space would be welcome. It's typically the OTHER guy who wants there to be less space so he can try to catch slick Loma. Not that it would actually help them much.

I don't think he would struggle with leg kicks unless he was oblivious to them in 2019. Not ****ing likely. If he trains for MMA just like anyone else he's going to know how to deal with legkicks as he will have trained for it properly. People who struggle with leg kicks are not the norm in MMA, most fighters don't struggle with leg kicks- that is quite rare.

By the way always wondered why boxers in KB wouldnt just push forward and try to KO the kickboxers ASAP in such bouts. Just pressure and try to end it fast. Do you have an example of a boxer winning a KB match vs a kick boxer?

Mike Bernardo did just that in K-1, also Francis Botha wrecked house without kicking basically at all. They were both lower tier boxers that just decided to go right into K-1 and did awesomely. Most successful strikers in MMA, especially at the highest level, hardly kick at all, if ever. Kicks are mostly used to finish off an opponent who is already effed up. Kicks are not a major part of the fight game in MMA like they were 15+ years ago, most get by without them unless they're especially talented at them (less than one in 100).

 

[Reyesnuthugr]

There have been at least four K1 World Grand Prix champions who competed in MMA in their primes on more than a part time basis. None of them was ever #1 in the world in MMA.

Mark Hunt
Semmy Schilt
Mirko Filipovic
Alistair Overeem

All those guys were top contenders for a long time. I don't know if you remember but there was a time when Mirko WAS rated #1 in MMA, he was unstoppable as soon as he showed up. Nobody could take him down and he would end everybody. Also Chuck Liddell, who only struck, that guy was rated #1 for a long time in the UFC.

 

[Based and White Pilled]

All those guys were top contenders for a long time. I don't know if you remember but there was a time when Mirko WAS rated #1 in MMA, he was unstoppable as soon as he showed up. Nobody could take him down and he would end everybody. Also Chuck Liddell, who only struck, that guy was rated #1 for a long time in the UFC.

CC was never number 1. He was number 2/3 for a couple years.

Chuck had a lot more than a training camp's worth of wrestling training.

I was getting drunk and enjoying your shit posts yesterday. I'm done talking about this now.

 

[Ilk]

He would do great in a large ring, he loves to use space. He also uses primarily offensive angles (with defense built in-- angles that escape AND setup nasty counters in the same moment) so he doesn't rely too hard on needing the extra space, but the extra space would be welcome. It's typically the OTHER guy who wants there to be less space so he can try to catch slick Loma. Not that it would actually help them much.

I don't think he would struggle with leg kicks unless he was oblivious to them in 2019. Not ****ing likely. If he trains for MMA just like anyone else he's going to know how to deal with legkicks as he will have trained for it properly. People who struggle with leg kicks are not the norm in MMA, most fighters don't struggle with leg kicks- that is quite rare.



Mike Bernardo did just that in K-1, also Francis Botha wrecked house without kicking basically at all. They were both lower tier boxers that just decided to go right into K-1 and did awesomely. Most successful strikers in MMA, especially at the highest level, hardly kick at all, if ever. Kicks are mostly used to finish off an opponent who is already effed up. Kicks are not a major part of the fight game in MMA like they were 15+ years ago, most get by without them unless they're especially talented at them (less than one in 100).

I just wstched Botha wreck Bonjaski until Bonjaski landed a lucky high kick and the refs gave him the decision.


But Botha is no low skill boxer. In his prime his loses are only to few of the greatest heavy weights - Tyson, Holyfield, Klichko ...

But man that match vs Bonjaski was a joy. I wonder how he survived such a beating. I guess age played a huge role.

Regarding Bernardo he is indeed a low level boxer entering K1 but he seems to apply more of a kick boxing style. While Botha seems like you typical boxer. Comming of the jab and landing some heavy body punches. Just a joy to watch.

Thank you. I will keep watching more of their k1 matches... they make me feel thst is someone like Loma enters MMA he may take 3 cathegories not only 2 lol

 

[Reyesnuthugr]

CC was never number 1. He was number 2/3 for a couple years.

Chuck had a lot more than a training camp's worth of wrestling training.

There was a time when Crocop was #1. Dana even said he thought Crocop was #1 in the world and unbeatable, despite Crocop being in Pride, not UFC. You're probably just looking at past record, I was there paying attention at that time.

Loma had more than a training camp's worth of wrestling training, also, a lot more. He is well versed, he is actually a wrestler.

I was getting drunk and enjoying your shit posts yesterday. I'm done talking about this now.

That's cool. Once you actually have experience in what you talk about maybe you'll have some credibility and a seat at the adult's table.

 

[Ilk]

Just watched this as well. Well when a boxer is prepared it seems they can give hard times to elite kick boxers. Bernado seems to have an impressive career in k1. While Botha seems to have earned a huge respect besides his bad record.

 

[AndyMaBobs]

This is what I was saying as well. There is pretty much bigger chance a guy like Loma is finished like that than losing by being taken down. I really doubt there are skilled enough wrestlers to catch him. But leg kicks and a huge ring are something he will strugle with.

By the way always wondered why boxers in KB wouldnt just push forward and try to KO the kickboxers ASAP in such bouts. Just pressure and try to end it fast. Do you have an example of a boxer winning a KB match vs a kick boxer?

Try to push forward against someone kicking you in the leg.

There's not an example that I know of, though that doesn't mean that they don't exist. I have more examples of kickboxers being successful in boxing than the other way around. Tyrone Spong and Kyotaro are top heavyweights in boxing now.

 

[rmongler]

Did not know prawling is a fucking hard skill to master. Man this is not a 40 years old fat Toney we are talking about. We are speaking for a guy that is a boxing prodigy, with world class footwork and wrestling back ground...

Takedown defense is indeed a non-trivial capacity to develop; even harder for persons coming in with perspectives like this.

 

[Ilk]

Takedown defense is indeed a non-trivial capacity to develop; even harder for persons coming in with perspectives like this.

Dude I wrestled when I was 7 years old. Literally the first thing you learn is the double and how to defend it so you can partner drill it. It is in the Soviet system to partner drill in wrestling non stop. My coach was Bonev a silver medalist in an European Cup. He coached my old man as well. This is literally my only memory from wrestling while I was indeed going Monday Friday for 2 years. How to double leg and defend it.

If you think some fighter from Ukraine has not wrestled... let me tell you you are wrong. Ukraine is probably the most Soviet country of them all. They perhaps still have wrestling in their physical school education, just as we did.

 

[rmongler]

Dude I wrestled when I was 7 years old. Literally the first thing you learn is the double and how to defend it so you can partner drill it. It is in the Soviet system to partner drill in wrestling non stop. My coach was Bonev a silver medalist in an European Cup. He coached my old man as well. This is literally my only memory from wrestling while I was indeed going Monday Friday for 2 years. How to double leg and defend it.

If you think some fighter from Ukraine has not wrestled... let me tell you you are wrong. Ukraine is probably the most Soviet country of them all. They perhaps still have wrestling in their physical school education, just as we did.

Certainly it's true that Lomachenko did many sports, like wrestling, in younger years; this is also a separate and only tangentially related point to what i was responding too.

 

[Cole train]

Dude I wrestled when I was 7 years old. Literally the first thing you learn is the double and how to defend it so you can partner drill it. It is in the Soviet system to partner drill in wrestling non stop. My coach was Bonev a silver medalist in an European Cup. He coached my old man as well. This is literally my only memory from wrestling while I was indeed going Monday Friday for 2 years. How to double leg and defend it.

If you think some fighter from Ukraine has not wrestled... let me tell you you are wrong. Ukraine is probably the most Soviet country of them all. They perhaps still have wrestling in their physical school education, just as we did.

The crosstraining thingy come from "sport camps"

Basically for example during summer times athletes of different sports are under one roof in a big ass "concentration camp" lol

My mom was in soviet volleyball team and grandad was in soviet international team in track and field.

My grandad knew basics of the soviet "hand to hand combat" sport because he went to their practise for the hell of it if he had time lol

(My mom hated wrestlers because sauna after them smelled like shit)

 

[Ilk]

The crosstraining thingy come from "sport camps"

Basically for example during summer times athletes of different sports are under one roof in a big ass "concentration camp" lol

My mom was in soviet volleyball team and grandad was in soviet international team in track and field.

My grandad knew basics of the soviet "hand to hand combat" sport because he went to their practise for the hell of it if he had time lol

(My mom hated wrestlers because sauna after them smelled like shit)

Well from my old man I know he has been boxing as well. Also their wrestling team had two work outs with the olympic lifters and two with the soccer players. That is in a sports school. So a lot of cross training even sports schools. We still have some. There is one in my town.