Making the switch from powerlifting to fighting

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Do y'all think there is any size/weight/strength that can negate elite skill? If so, how much stronger, taller, and heavier would Shaw need to be?
 
Do y'all think there is any size/weight/strength that can negate elite skill? If so, how much stronger, taller, and heavier would Shaw need to be?

Absolutely Possible, but I think it'd take a special set of circumstances along with that strength/weight.
 
At a certain point pure strength and size would win. Even if you think Shaw doesn't have that, there is some amount of strength and size that could negate the highest skill.
 
I grappled with people much larger than myself and they tap just the same but can last an extra few seconds on a submission. Shaw would be beaten by anyone of similar weight quickly, but he might make a 180 pound guy work an extra minute or two.
 
Do y'all think there is any size/weight/strength that can negate elite skill? If so, how much stronger, taller, and heavier would Shaw need to be?

Yes we think it and we said it clearly numerous time so stop beating a dead horse. He would crush flyweights bantamweights etc. They'd still have a chance but his sheer size and strength would be too much for them imo

Now against other HWs or even LHWs competitive black belts he'll be submitted like a kindergarten kid.

As much as there is a size discrepancy that can negate skill, there is also a skill discrepancy that can negate size. It works both ways. But you seem obsessed with one and dismissive of the other.

My advice is go get a full year of bjj (or wrestling) experience and you'll be surprised at what you can do to totally untrained guys.
 
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Yes we think it and we said it clearly numerous time so stop being a dead horse. He would crush flyweights bantamweights etc. They'd still have a chance but his sheer size and strength would be too much for them imo

Now against other HWs or even LHWs competitive black belts he'll be submitted like a kindergarten kid.

As much as their is a size discrepancy that can negate skill, there is also a skill discrepancy that can negate size. It works both ways. But you seem obsessed with one and dismissive of the other.

My advice is go get a full year of bjj (or wrestling) experience and you'll be surprised at what you can do to totally untrained guys.
He would be a pain in the ass to roll with if he just got blue belt level though
 
Do y'all think there is any size/weight/strength that can negate elite skill? If so, how much stronger, taller, and heavier would Shaw need to be?

At a certain point pure strength and size would win. Even if you think Shaw doesn't have that, there is some amount of strength and size that could negate the highest skill.

There's usually diminishing returns with size because mobility and cardio becomes a liability. Even when wrestling HW was unlimited, most competitors were <300 lbs. Biggest outlier we've seen in MMA was 350 lbs ripped Bob Sapp vs. Big Nog in 2002. Sapp somehow went 14 hard minutes, almost killing Nog in the process and IMO would have won had he been BJJ blue skill level.

Size + strength can compensate for skill gap but if you're a noob, that skill gap vs. an elite HW BJJer would be insurmountable. Where it could get interesting is if an elite strength competitor could achieve blue belt+ skill level while retaining most of his strongman size.

But there are two major impediments to this:

1) Getting good at grappling requires going hard, live rounds and that means building and maintaining grappling cardio. And that's at odds with strongman/powerlifter training regimen and required recovery to maintain 300+ lbs.

2) It's harder for really big guys to learn good grappling technique. We've all seen it in class. The really big strong dudes get used to muscling things and can get away with it, even vs. other heavyweights.

There's a former competitive powerlifter in my BJJ class who used to weigh 300 lbs probably ~20% bf. Squatted 700 lbs in competition. 3 years ago during his first week, my 170 lbs fresh blue belt ass took his back and tapped him at will. Now that he's got 3 years BJJ and a 2 stripe blue, he's about 280 lbs (still strength trains), can go hard for a few 5 min rounds during rolling, and makes the black belts have to work. Our 165 lbs BB coach can usually take his back but says he has to play his A game to do so. But a decent ~250 lbs BJJ BB would crush him.

Another former strongman I'd like to see in BJJ is Pudzianowski. His wikipedia says he's BJJ purple and if that's true and he can get on the mat >300, while I don't see him beating elite guys, I think he could be interesting vs. regular HW BBs.
 
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Now against other HWs or even LHWs competitive black belts he'll be submitted like a kindergarten kid.

Yeah, I'm not seeing any way a LHW would submit him like a kindergartener. If you think that's true, that's fine though. There's not much to discuss at this point. You think size and strength are negligible factors if there is a wide skill gap. I disagree, but neither one will convince the other and there aren't enough comparable scenarios to make even an educated guess.

There aren't many 6ft 8, 400 pound strongest men in history, so we don't know how they'd do.
 
Yeah, I'm not seeing any way a LHW would submit him like a kindergartener. If you think that's true, that's fine though. There's not much to discuss at this point. You think size and strength are negligible factors if there is a wide skill gap. I disagree, but neither one will convince the other and there aren't enough comparable scenarios to make even an educated guess.

There aren't many 6ft 8, 400 pound strongest men in history, so we don't know how they'd do.
We can sure approximate. Watch this woman work this guy who has 100 pounds on her. It would look a lot like that. However, if shaw learned a handful of escapes well and maybe an armbar, arm triangle and americana/kimura (should be able to rotate those two until the arm is straight and then sub with his weight and strength) he would be competitive with people much more skilled than himself. Maybe all the way up to black belt, but elites will beat him like me wrestling a toddler
 
We can sure approximate. Watch this woman work this guy who has 100 pounds on her. It would look a lot like that. However, if shaw learned a handful of escapes well and maybe an armbar, arm triangle and americana/kimura (should be able to rotate those two until the arm is straight and then sub with his weight and strength) he would be competitive with people much more skilled than himself. Maybe all the way up to black belt, but elites will beat him like me wrestling a toddler


Doesn't look like 100 lbs weight difference to me but still very very impressive. Honestly wonder WTF the instructor was thinking to have a woman go with an angry, jacked spaz with a huge weight and strength advantage. That dude must have been hella pissed to wake up and still be out for blood. When someone goes out cold like that, almost always they're disoriented and peaceful AF when they come to.
 
Doesn't look like 100 lbs weight difference to me but still very very impressive. Honestly wonder WTF the instructor was thinking to have a woman go with an angry, jacked spaz with a huge weight and strength advantage. That dude must have been hella pissed to wake up and still be out for blood. When someone goes out cold like that, almost always they're disoriented and peaceful AF when they come to.
She's not even an advanced belt really. It would be worse if you took her to brown or black belt, let alone elite. That's an enormous weight and strength difference.
 
We can sure approximate. Watch this woman work this guy who has 100 pounds on her. It would look a lot like that. However, if shaw learned a handful of escapes well and maybe an armbar, arm triangle and americana/kimura (should be able to rotate those two until the arm is straight and then sub with his weight and strength) he would be competitive with people much more skilled than himself. Maybe all the way up to black belt, but elites will beat him like me wrestling a toddler


Doesn't look like 100 lbs weight difference to me but still very very impressive. Honestly wonder WTF the instructor was thinking to have a woman go with an angry, jacked spaz with a huge weight and strength advantage. That dude must have been hella pissed to wake up and still be out for blood. When someone goes out cold like that, almost always they're disoriented and peaceful AF when they come to.

Not trying to make any points about the discussion, but this one in particular is a fake video lol. The guy is a bodybuilder/youtuber who does skits, he has a whole channel full of them, it's not real. Here's a similar video by the same guy doing the same thing, I believe they're pranking the rest of the class.



https://www.youtube.com/c/RamboCuzthaGunz33/videos
 
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She's not even an advanced belt really. It would be worse if you took her to brown or black belt, let alone elite. That's an enormous weight and strength difference.

Not saying that a BB would win because obviously not, but this is a fake video lol. The guy is a bodybuilder/youtuber who does set up skits, he has a whole channel full of them, it's not real. Here's a similar video by the same guy doing the same thing, I believe they're pranking the rest of the class.



https://www.youtube.com/c/RamboCuzthaGunz33/videos


From the youtube comments, sounds like it probably is fake. I don't doubt it's possible for an athletic purple belt woman to sub a bodybuilder with no grappling experience like that, but would be crazy irresponsible of her coach. Unless the woman is Cyborg or Gabi Garcia, the strength disparity would be hella dangerous. If the guy were really going for broke, the woman likely gets picked up and slammed/spiked and/or takes some strike damage even if she eventually gets the sub.
 
From the youtube comments, sounds like it probably is fake. I don't doubt it's possible for an athletic purple belt woman to sub a bodybuilder with no grappling experience like that, but would be crazy irresponsible of her coach. Unless the woman is Cyborg or Gabi Garcia, the strength disparity would be hella dangerous. If the guy were really going for broke, the woman likely gets picked up and slammed/spiked and/or takes some strike damage even if she eventually gets the sub.
Ok well then
 
I have seen 130 lb blue belt pretty easily beat a novice white belt who had at least 50 lb on them. Little guy was a smoker too.
 
I have seen 130 lb blue belt pretty easily beat a novice white belt who had at least 50 lb on them. Little guy was a smoker too.
As a 330lbs blue belt I routinely smashed anyone that wasn't the instructor regardless of size or belt rank. I had very good technique though and my state is very slow to promote belts. I'd probably be a purple elsewhere with 7+ years on the mats.
 
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