Michael Jai White Kyokushin sparring footage

[StanClarker]

Not to rain on you'll parade, but kyokushin is probably second only to muay Thai in successful participants in K1.

Yeah, all equally poor.

He’s a troll don’t worry about him

Standard TSF boilerplate denials.

 

[StanClarker]

I found some excellent Kyo training... but ya all wur meen.

 

[StanClarker]

He’s a troll don’t worry about him

Troll? Troll you say. They've got a thread patting Conor on the back for going 10 rounds against Floyd.

 

[Blake_UK]

I'm searching for a karate class video to also emphasize your point. When I find it I will edit.
EDIT: Here's that Rokas dude who ditched Aikido for MMA by SBG. SBG is big for actual sparring, Muay Thai, BJJ, etc., the MMA-heavy arts.

DUBLIN
From MMA To Karate - Spinning Kicks and Blitzing • Martial Arts Journey
37,392 views
•Dec 10, 2019


Martial Arts Journey
116K subscribers
Giving Karate a shot was on my bucket list for a while. Thankfully to the Hombu Dojo Karate in Dublin, they invited me to try out a couple of their Karate classes. Join me in this Martial Arts Journey and experience my first Karate classes together.

The takeaway is that Rokas is now willing to open his mind & try Traditional martial arts again.. . then makes a judgement when he's a donk like me w boxing footwork (now getting better but so embarrassing)... yet 'concludes' about karate. "Spinning kicks and Blitzing..."

What the head instructor imparts is that there is a lot to the Shotokan? karate style to get it to work... then look at the class... they too look poor. [There's a girl black-belt who does a kick just like you say, then steps down off balance leaning w face into the pad holder just like the mjw kyo sparring partner idiot. Exactly what the karate instructor says YOU CANNOT DO.]

The moral of the video is that one has to approach the art with intelligence to what the art is really all about... and as the Shotokan? head instructor makes very plain... it's not about wanging on the other guy... head or not.

Which all cycles back to that girl challenge boxing video I posted and which I never forgot. You have to do more than go through the motions... one has to dedicate oneself to the program. Only then will it be good.

It's even more stupid to damage your brain. A value of the Joe Louis highlight is that is showcases boxers standing in front of the opponent round after round taking strong head shots.

It isn't 'no head shots vs absolute slugfest' that's a straw man; the point is even light sparring with head shots is a better learning tool than 'tough kumite' without.

We don't have to throw people to know how to throw people.

I really disagree with that. Theory can never beat actual experience. Just the person you are throwing shifting their weight changes the whole dynamic of the movement.

You have most guys here who want to mix it up... hence bias.

Maybe so but it's a "bias" that is shared with the vast majority of people involved in self defence, combat sports and martial arts. There is a reason why virtually all the most succesful systems/arts/fighters etc utilise contact sparring.

What the head instructor imparts is that there is a lot to the Shotokan? karate style to get it to work...

Which is part of the problem. There is no point knowing dozens of flashy moves if you can't even get the basics right. Youtube is full of TMA 'masters' getting dropped because of this. I have trained MT with a Teakwondo black belt who could spinning kick over my head but constantly had his chin up, dropped his hands and whose footwork was poor. Every sparring session he put himself in dangerous situations (like giving his back after landing a kick or walking on to potential counters) without even realizing it as his fight IQ was minimal. He had picked up bad habits through 'play-fighting'. If I was a more aggressive sparring partner or we were in competition/the street he could have got badly hurt.

There's a girl black-belt who does a kick just like you say, then steps down off balance leaning w face into the pad holder just like the mjw kyo sparring partner idiot. Exactly what the karate instructor says YOU CANNOT DO.

The point is if a black belt is doing it it shows that the training is not fulfilling it's main purpose of teaching. If you did that in boxing/MT/kickboxing you would get hit in the face - which is an excellent teaching aid. You learn from your knocks; just like mollycoddled children mollycoddled martial artists won't progress.

To be clear I rate Karate (and other TMAs) and it can be very useful bot in combat sports and real world self defence but they need to bring their training into the 21st century.

 

[spacetime]

I think they will kick the shit out of an untrained opponent and have historically been successful in MMA and kickboxing.

So this thread is for dummies

There was a Kyokushin crisis when they tried out K1 before learning boxing, so no.

When the first Kyokushin champions were sent to fight in the K-1 kickboxing rings, following Mas Oyama’s death, they were tragically defeated, leading to a critical collapse in the popularity of Kyokushin in Japan. The Japanese public no longer believed Kyokushin to be the world’s strongest karate.

 

[AndyMaBobs]

There was a Kyokushin krisis when they tried out K1 before learning boxing, so no.

When the first Kyokushin champions were sent to fight in the K-1 kickboxing rings, following Mas Oyama’s death, they were tragically defeated, leading to a critical collapse in the popularity of Kyokushin in Japan. The Japanese public no longer believed Kyokushin to be the world’s strongest karate.

They went 2-1 against lumpinee stadium fighters too, so that doesn't count for much

 

[StanClarker]

It isn't 'no head shots vs absolute slugfest' that's a straw man; the point is even light sparring with head shots is a better learning tool than 'tough kumite' without.

This is true, made very front & center in boxing training, the science of the program.

BTW, I lost again in randori.

I really disagree with that. Theory can never beat actual experience. Just the person you are throwing shifting their weight changes the whole dynamic of the movement.

That's fair. Judo's founder particularly created randori to account for that. Yet despite the fact that I've been losing (three sessions now w senior belts), it's not about winning... to me.

Maybe so but it's a "bias" that is shared with the vast majority of people involved in self defence, combat sports and martial arts. There is a reason why virtually all the most succesful systems/arts/fighters etc utilise contact sparring.

Again a true statement to a large degree. What makes your stance even stronger is the psuedo-martial artist group which is so prominent in TMA, which really has no idea of what they are doing with their techniques... even the straightforward ones.... it's so bad like that Rokas dude who took 10 years to Wake Up.

Saw a video along these lines that TSF would absolutely love... way tops that BJJ killer smashing the aikido talker. Hopefully I can find it.

Which is part of the problem. There is no point knowing dozens of flashy moves if you can't even get the basics right. Youtube is full of TMA 'masters' getting dropped because of this.

See above... right w you. I even commented @ the outset on some kempo? video... like wow, great if they can pull it off... but way dubious... way too flashy complicated... IMO. Not something I would personally try even if I saw it in my area... don't see kempo, I think there is kenpo.

I have trained MT with a Teakwondo black belt who could spinning kick over my head but constantly had his chin up, dropped his hands and whose footwork was poor.

Yeah, it's in the Kyo video too, the black-belt sparring partner w MJW... same stuff. And I put up that girl kyo competition w black-belts,,, and the one is standing stock in front w their adapted guard... blam Kick KTFO.

I say, though, what do these black-belts think they are doing? That Rokas video, the guy is lost in the Ireland Shotokan karate class... I think it's much harder to master to a functional level than kicking good, which most student couldn't do either.

Every sparring session he put himself in dangerous situations (like giving his back after landing a kick or walking on to potential counters) without even realizing it as his fight IQ was minimal. He had picked up bad habits through 'play-fighting'. If I was a more aggressive sparring partner or we were in competition/the street he could have got badly hurt.

Yeah, that's it... play fighting. Judo's ' full contact' randori takes care of that.... Even so, we don't consider our practice Judo sessions 'playing.'

Traditional martial arts is chock full of people who don't really get it... even aside from the jokes (hope I can find that barn burner of an idiot one.). They're a lot of fun to watch though.

The point is if a black belt is doing it it shows that the training is not fulfilling it's main purpose of teaching. If you did that in boxing/MT/kickboxing you would get hit in the face - which is an excellent teaching aid. You learn from your knocks; just like mollycoddled children mollycoddled martial artists won't progress.

I've kinda made a statement about that here... but it wasn't liked. Too biased.

I'll add another post. But boxing science addresses all that you've talked about... yet these MMA camps look like play fighting... including the hard fighting 'cause they'e just bashing each other in the name of Not-Mollycoddlling.

To be clear I rate Karate (and other TMAs) and it can be very useful bot in combat sports and real world self defence but they need to bring their training into the 21st century.

Yeah, there's the bias. Gracie's started all that commercially. Look what happened to them.

 

[StanClarker]

To be clear I rate Karate (and other TMAs) and it can be very useful bot in combat sports and real world self defence but they need to bring their training into the 21st century.

Here's this dooseee, giving all the MMA proponents the fodder for their MMA Cannon.
Free Karate Lessons in North London

932 views
•Aug 31, 2017

shotolondon
366 subscribers

Here's the deal. See all these black-belts marching along? Are these the black-belts trained in Shotokan? Of 100 years ago? I'm guessing it's Shotokan karate. I see a club where people in gi's go to socialize by play karate? Playing w others playing.

Frankly, this is why I haven't even yet visited my local TKD school... it's a couple miles. I'm afraid of what I'll find.

ANyhow... it tops any dumb karate vid out there, IMO. I mean that slim Blonde Master? Instructor is gonna take on Holly Holm? Holm would ragdoll her from here to Sunday.

This is what the UFC should be signing up to boost it's stock... and no kidding. The lead guy could really have something to talk about. Holly Holm sunset challenge!

 

[spacetime]

They went 2-1 against lumpinee stadium fighters too, so that doesn't count for much

?? That was ages ago when they had face punching in their sparring format in their clubs

 

[Sinister]

Oh here's another "hey I have never done anything competitive consistently and yet I believe I know and am better than famous people who have trained their whole lives" thing.

 

[StanClarker]

I won the last troll exchange on round count. Promise there.

 

[Gfreak]

Yeah, and they are trolling on me for saying so. This just shows MJW's opponent doesn't have an skill base for his technique. I mean just look @ his footwork... random, backing away, walking around.

But wait, you said This in Stan clarker's sparring thread.

I thought it looked decent. You're using footwork, which a lot of MMA competitors don't.

Furthermore, it's got a nice pace. Pressure that measured

So...do you LIKE random backing away, walking around footowkr? Or do you not. Definitely a troll lol.

 

[StanClarker]

But wait, you said This in Stan clarker's sparring thread.


So...do you LIKE random backing away, walking around footowkr? Or do you not. Definitely a troll lol.

Yes, that's what I thought when I saw yur alurt.