Usman would have destroyed Mike Tyson(Proof)

[LetThemBleed]

Not really, I find Usman entertaining as a fighter, the Masvidal fight is the one i'm answering in regards to because it's the one you mentioned, it's probably the worst Usman fight to watch I agree, I'm not disagreeing with that but we're talking like Usman is the only great fighter to have a boring fight, he can have one boring fight and still be an enjoyable fighter to watch as a whole. What elite fighter has never not had a boring fight?

That fight involved 2 people, no-one's calling Masvidal a boring fighter but he could have made that fight much more entertaining just as much as Usman could. It's just easy for people to call Usman boring because he has a grappling heavy style but Usman won every single round in that fight still, it wasn't like Izzy/Yoel where they just stared at each other for 5 rounds.

263 of 341 - Usman striking stats from that fight.

88 of 157 - Masvidal's striking stats from that fight

94 of 151 Usmans significant striking stats from that fight

66 of 125 Masvidals significant striking stats.

He outstruck Masvidal, one of the best strikers in the UFC 4 rounds to 1 still and the round where Masvidal outstruck him in round 1, he still controlled Masvidal for over half the round.

Do I think Usman is a boring fighter? No. Do I think the Masvidal fight was as great as I thought it would be? No.

They won't be the first 2 great fighters to have a boring fight and won't be the last.

I'd be curious to see a further breakdown of those numbers, guessing foot stomps would account for a significant portion of those numbers. Equally I'd have to re-watch that fight to be 100 percent certain but to find 88 strikes in that fight from Usman that should be termed significant would likely have me questioning the definition of the word significant and how it is differentiated from a normal strike. Tbh I'm not going to as I'd have to be some kind of masochist to want to re-watch that shit show again.

Izzy and Yoel was worse but certainly not by that much and the gap between the two fights is arguably somewhat overstated as collectively I think people expected a lot more from the Izzy Yoel fight than they did the Usman Masvidal fight, most people suspected Usman would use a heavy clinch game plan. Lastly you're absolutely right you could argue that was an aberrant performance for an elite fighter with a backlog of exciting fights but for the fact in this instance that Usman's got a history of rather dull performances on his record. I wonder if the Usman we saw in the Colby fight will turn out to be the exception rather than the norm as Colby was perhaps the only guy in the division that Usman wasn't convinced he could beat with his wrestling and wall and stall tactics for the majority of a 25 minute fight, guess we'll see how he does against Burns in a month or so.

 

[John of Arc]

Imagine watching the Colby/Usman fight and still calling him snoozeman.

Imagine ignoring the rest of snoozemans fights to try pretend he's entertaining to watch.

 

[sampuncher]

Imagine ignoring the rest of snoozemans fights to try pretend he's entertaining to watch.

Not at all but it's pretty easy to debunk someone calling a fighter boring when I've named one fight that was nominated for FOTY in which he TKO'd someone who had never been finished and is debatably their only real competition in the division.

I also enjoyed the Woodley, Moraes, RDA and Edwards fights aswell and his fights on TUF, maybe give them a watch x

 

[sampuncher]

Most of the WW Champions have had boring fights. I mean recently look at Woodley, GSP. Lawler is an exception but he ended up having a short reign due to his style and was also lucky to get a win over Condit

Literally the first reply was "make the WW division great again" but besides Robbie there's never really been a WW champ that didn't have a wrestling heavy style. I'd love to hear them elaborate on that point.

 

[Kid Quick]

I hope Burns makes the WW division great again.
I had enough snoozeman.

I prefer the nickname "Fake Newsman".

 

[John of Arc]

Not at all but it's pretty easy to debunk someone calling a fighter boring when I've named one fight that was nominated for FOTY in which he TKO'd someone who had never been finished and is debatably their only real competition in the division.

I also enjoyed the Woodley, Moraes, RDA and Edwards fights aswell and his fights on TUF, maybe give them a watch x

I watched them all at the time, the Woodley one was the worst. It was so boring that Woodley was nearly falling asleep. The RDA fight was actually pretty fun, maybe I'm being too harsh on the man but he does have some incredibly bad fights on his resume, real snoozers so to speak. You make a good point that he does have some decent fights along with one all time great fight.

 

[snaportap21]

I knew exactly what this thread was before i clicked. Have you seen norm macdonald and tyson talk about it specifically? It's hilarious. Norm and miike's dynamic is better in real life than the cartoon.

 

[Eric Silva 2.0]

Imagine watching the Colby/Usman fight and still calling him snoozeman.

or the Usman/Woodley fight. It's such a lack of appreciation for what greatness is and the kind of work that goes into it.

 

[sampuncher]

I watched them all at the time, the Woodley one was the worst. It was so boring that Woodley was nearly falling asleep. The RDA fight was actually pretty fun, maybe I'm being too harsh on the man but he does have some incredibly bad fights on his resume, real snoozers so to speak. You make a good point that he does have some decent fights along with one all time great fight.

I enjoyed the Usman/Woodley fight purely for the way Woodley had nothing for him, unfortunately that's typical Woodley though, as seen in too many of his fights, when he doesn't wanna be in there it's very apparent. If the 1st round doesn't go that well for Tyron, you pretty much know exactly how the remaining 4 rounds are going to go for him.

 

[Carrotman23]

Imagine watching the Colby/Usman fight and still calling him snoozeman.

hmmm its almost like all his other fights besides that grudge match have been a snooze fest.. wild bro

 

[Eric Silva 2.0]

You've changed your tune though entirely your original post was saying how could anyone find Usman boring and call him snoozeman, I've answered it and you've tacitly agreed with me that the fight wasn't entertaining now you're pivoting to saying you understand why Usman chose to not make it entertaining, two totally different things. I absolutely concur that his gameplan was the smartest way for Usman to win the fight and the easiest way to win whilst giving himself the greatest chance to avoid any major damage, he executed that gameplan well, fair play to the man but bottom line it was boring as bat shit.

It wasn't boring in the way you say. Did Tyron's switch turn off after he realized he couldn't do anything against Tyron. He got beat standing, in the clinch, on the ground, everywhere. Much different than the press conference before the fight. He's not McGregor in there but he isn't boring and he wins. He usually dominates.

 

[bigconan]

Damn, Mike just revealed his weakness to the entire world, crazy. Motherfuckers are going to be stomping on his two's everywhere he goes now so they can claim they beat up the guy that was once arguably the most feared fighter on the planet.

You know Mitch Green is out hunting for him as we speak to finally get his revenge over the guy he proudly called "sissily Tyson" on national TV while being barely recognizable after that "sissy" broke every bone in his face. Lol.

I used to love mitch blood green...that guy was a true gangster. he really was...a bad ass thug. one of the few people that went the distance with tyson in his prime...and did fairly well...he had absolutely no fear of mike...zero...and they way he insulted him was funny as hell.

 

[Fight Professor]

He would stomp the hell out of Tyson's feet.

 

[cshireman4]

I completely agree, but then when MMA judging is what it is, I completely get why guys like Leon, Usman etc do what they have to do to win fights, they know the judging criteria and don't really ever make it a difficult night for judges scoring fights. Point fighting isn't fighting you're completely right but then in a real fight, someone won't be scoring it for "control time" for example.

I agree 100%. I'm very much in the "don't hate the player, hate the game" camp on this one. But I don't enjoy watching the kinds of fights that the current scoring system encourages and do my best to avoid them when I can. You get what you consent. Just as the fighters have no incentive to change their styles while the current scoring system exists, MMA as a whole has no incentive to change its scoring structure, so long as it doesn't affect their bottom line. I'm not naive enough to think that my "stand" is going to amount to noticeable change though. So I settle for bitching about it on Sherdog instead lmao

 

[sampuncher]

hmmm its almost like all his other fights besides that grudge match have been a snooze fest.. wild bro

It's almost like you just only want to watch stand up fights or haven't bothered to watch his other fights....casual bro.

 

[sampuncher]

I agree 100%. I'm very much in the "don't hate the player, hate the game" camp on this one. But I don't enjoy watching the kinds of fights that the current scoring system encourages and do my best to avoid them when I can. You get what you consent. Just as the fighters have no incentive to change their styles while the current scoring system exists, MMA as a whole has no incentive to change its scoring structure, so long as it doesn't affect their bottom line. I'm not naive enough to think that my "stand" is going to amount to noticeable change though. So I settle for bitching about it on Sherdog instead lmao

Exactly that, same reason I agree with Dana about an open scoring system, if some fighters knew they were up 39-36 going into a 5th round, you can imagine there being a fair portion of fights who would coast completely for that last round.

 

[Murder_KickHC]

Khamzat KOs Fury, Joshua, Ruiz and Wilder in one night.

Lets just hope he will be able to fight oneday and his lungs are not permanently destroyed.

 

[Paulsp]

Imagine watching the Colby/Usman fight and still calling him snoozeman.

so 1 or 2 good fight negate his countless boring ones?

Well then tecia Torres has a tko win so I officially deem her a knockout artist

 

[jitzmonkey]

Point fighting is not an aspect of the sport that I enjoy. If you have the opponent's offense neutralized, what is the excuse for not being able to finish them? Or at the very least, try. I watch D1 wrestling if I want to see god tier takedowns and top control. Khabib doesn't fit this description for me since he absolutely ragdolls and/or finishes guys regularly, so I have no issue with him. But GSP and Usman are hard to watch imo. I will say, it is impressive that every one of their opponents knows exactly what they are going to do and still can't do anything about it. I get that. But damn. Point fighting is not fighting. That's the difference for me. To each their own though.

And to be clear, it isn't just grapplers. Wonderboy, Dominick Cruz, and even Jon Jones over the last few years are the striking equivalent of the same problem.

Agreed here. I love watching WW GSP, JBJ (last few years), Usman, etc... fights for the strategy and technique; but it's more academic than exciting.
Masvidal throws proper technique and tries to hurt people. That makes his fights fun to watch live (not that I'm his biggest fan.)

 

[sampuncher]

so 1 or 2 good fight negate his countless boring ones, in my opinion?

*Fixed it for you.