Utterly bizarre scarf hold-esque choke finish in Bellator

[EndlessCritic]

Hopefully you can see the link. Poclit is in bottom mount, bridges out, and manages to catch Schiro in a deep head and arm scarf hold grip where he's holding onto his own leg. Schiro rolls out onto his knees (and feet), seemingly escaping any pin, but Poclit is still able to choke him unconscious with the scarf hold grip.

Can't say I've ever seen a finishing position like it. Here's just the finishing position, which really doesn't show that this was originally a standard scarf hold:

 

[ChickenBrother]

Hopefully you can see the link. Poclit is in bottom mount, bridges out, and manages to catch Schiro in a deep head and arm scarf hold grip where he's holding onto his own leg. Schiro rolls out onto his knees (and feet), seemingly escaping any pin, but Poclit is still able to choke him unconscious with the scarf hold grip.

Can't say I've ever seen a finishing position like it. Here's just the finishing position, which really doesn't show that this was originally a standard scarf hold:

This looks intriguing. First link doesn't work for me in the U.S. and I looked but can't find the lead up to the finish anywhere online. How does Poclit go straight from bottom mount to top scarf hold? Maybe an upa sweep as Schiro is posturing up to punch, followed by kesa gatame?

And what does Poclit do to deny Schiro taking his back when he rolls out? I really like scarf hold, this holding onto my own leg variation in particular, but I usually bail on the head and arm to avoid getting my back taken if they roll out of it. It's blowing my mind I could just hold onto it and somehow get a sub like this. Something to play with during Monday rolls for sure.

 

[Peteyandjia]

Here's just the finishing position, which really doesn't show that this was originally a standard scarf hold:

Poclit never quite had a standard scarf. He almost did, that's what he reached up from mounted & was going for, but he was never quite able to roll Schiro onto his back.

If anything, Schiro's insistence to stay up, keep fighting for top position & not just roll with it, ended up putting & keeping him in this very strange position with all of the torque going through his neck & turning the hold into a strangle. Pretty wild stuff.

 

[Peteyandjia]

How does Poclit go straight from bottom mount to top scarf hold?

Starts with a headlock & a bridge. Schiro blocks the bridge with base & stays in mount, but then he puts his hands in trying to fight off the headlock, & that's when Poclit traps an arm as well & is able to chase the scarf.

And what does Poclit do to deny Schiro taking his back when he rolls out?

Keeps the arm & head control, throughout the scrambling.

As long as you keep those, you can be on bottom scarf and still dominate, sweep back to classic top scarf, or even submit, as we see here. Although a much more likely submission to attack from bottom scarf instead of this weird ass strangle, is the South Americana (Americana their arm using only your legs).

 

[ChickenBrother]

Starts with a headlock & a bridge. Schiro blocks the bridge with base & stays in mount, but then he puts his hands in trying to fight off the headlock, & that's when Poclit traps an arm as well & is able to chase the scarf.



Keeps the arm & head control, throughout the scrambling.

As long as you keep those, you can be on bottom scarf and still dominate, sweep back to classic top scarf, or even submit, as we see here. Although a much more likely submission to attack from bottom scarf instead of this weird ass strangle, is the South Americana (Americana their arm using only your legs).

Damn I really wish I could see the full video. You mean Poclit goes for a front headlock (but from bottom mount) and then lets go to reset to scarf? Or he goes straight for scarf hold from bottom mount and tries to sweep Schiro in the direction of his combat base?

The "South Americana" is what I always go for from top scarf but I don't generally play scarf from bottom. Definitely some interesting ideas to play with on Monday.

 

[Bos Docken]

It's interesting, but it seems like one of those situations that eventuated more due to the chokee's mistakes rather than the choker's initiative. I doubt this sequence is anything Poclit has practiced or lands with regularity in training - unlike
Aleksei Oleinik, who you can tell has landed his unconventional choking sequences thousands of times before.

Reminds me of the weird bulldog choke Yancy Medeiros pulled off. The only reason he ended up in that position is because his opponent tried to escape a guillotine in the absolute worst way possible. The result was probably the first time either of them had been in that finishing position.

 

[Peteyandjia]

Damn I really wish I could see the full video. You mean Poclit goes for a front headlock (but from bottom mount) and then lets go to reset to scarf? Or he goes straight for scarf hold from bottom mount and tries to sweep Schiro in the direction of his combat base?

Polcit grabs a headlock from bottom mounted, never lets it go, eventually adds an arm in there to his collection as well (voila, scarf), which allows him to roll out of being mounted, & into a scramble where he's locked onto a scarf. He tries to run it all the way through to a classic top scarf, but Schiro fights to stay up on a knee. Which worked against himself in the long run, it ended up giving Polcit a harsher angle which turned what would normally be just a pin, into a strangle. Schiro not being on his back also resulted in his own bodyweight hanging off the strangle, which I'm sure added to its severity.

The "South Americana" is what I always go for from top scarf but I don't generally play scarf from bottom. Definitely some interesting ideas to play with on Monday.

Try grabbing a scarf from bottom, clasp your hand to your thigh same as you would in top. Once you do this, best two options:

1. (Reversal) Use your free arm to sit up to an elbow, then push off the floor with your hand in a circle, to spin them down. You end up with top scarf

2. (Submission, South Americana) Use your free hand to grab their wrist, shove it downward away from you, stepover & trap their wrist veins with your ankle. Then be very careful & slow in figuring out the breaking mechanics -- one because it's all legs & hips, which are very powerful & dangerous, and two because the actual control feels a bit nebulous & vague at first, it takes practice to get the feel for this, and figure out the angles, thus slower is better.

 

[Peteyandjia]

it seems like one of those situations that eventuated more due to the chokee's mistakes rather than the choker's initiative.

I see what you're getting at, but I think you are selling them a little short. Yes, it might not be something they were practicing before. However, it takes a next level mastery to be able to hold onto a position that would normally fall apart at that stage in most people's hands, but because they have trained that position enough to be a dog with a bone, they say 'No -- I've still got something here. I can make this work.' And they're not just being stubborn, it turns out they're correct. In a way, that's even more impressive to be able to play jazz like that, to improvise & pull out a clean strangulation, it shows a level of control, feel, & a deeper understanding of the position.

 

[ChickenBrother]

Polcit grabs a headlock from bottom mounted, never lets it go, eventually adds an arm in there to his collection as well (voila, scarf), which allows him to roll out of being mounted, & into a scramble where he's locked onto a scarf. He tries to run it all the way through to a classic top scarf, but Schiro fights to stay up on a knee. Which worked against himself in the long run, it ended up giving Polcit a harsher angle which turned what would normally be just a pin, into a strangle. Schiro not being on his back also resulted in his own bodyweight hanging off the strangle, which I'm sure added to its severity.

Great breakdown, thank you.

Try grabbing a scarf from bottom, clasp your hand to your thigh same as you would in top. Once you do this, best two options:

1. (Reversal) Use your free arm to sit up to an elbow, then push off the floor with your hand in a circle, to spin them down. You end up with top scarf

2. (Submission, South Americana) Use your free hand to grab their wrist, shove it downward away from you, stepover & trap their wrist veins with your ankle. Then be very careful & slow in figuring out the breaking mechanics -- one because it's all legs & hips, which are very powerful & dangerous, and two because the actual control feels a bit nebulous & vague at first, it takes practice to get the feel for this, and figure out the angles, thus slower is better.

From what positions is scarf from bottom viable? If I'm visualizing it correctly, you have to start from bottom side control? Because without your leg hanging off the side to grab on to, you'd otherwise just have an arm triangle from bottom, which I would just try to finish from closed or HG.

 

[Peteyandjia]

From what positions is scarf from bottom viable? If I'm visualizing it correctly, you have to start from bottom side control?

Any bottom pin. Side control yes, but also mounted, or even back controlled. Just about any bad position, if you can grab a headlock -- you have a chance to grab an arm as well, & upgrade it to a scarf. It's unorthodox & takes a lot of practice, but if sharpened, it can be quite effective.

 

[ChickenBrother]

Any bottom pin. Side control yes, but also mounted, or even back controlled. Just about any bad position, if you can grab a headlock -- you have a chance to grab an arm as well, & upgrade it to a scarf. It's unorthodox & takes a lot of practice, but if sharpened, it can be quite effective.

Would love to see any vid links to scarf from bottom from bottom mount or back taken. I really like head and arm control (wrestling and Judo base) and have decent success with it from standing or knees, particularly in conjunction with some variation of uchi mata, hane goshi, tai otoshi or harai goshi. But I think I gave up trying to initiate from bottom mount back in my white belt days. Really cool to hear it's viable even at the highest levels of MMA.

 

[ChickenBrother]

Reminds me of the weird bulldog choke Yancy Medeiros pulled off. The only reason he ended up in that position is because his opponent tried to escape a guillotine in the absolute worst way possible. The result was probably the first time either of them had been in that finishing position.

Yikes. Turning into the guillotine like that looks like Choke Yourself, Private Pyle - jime.

 

[shunyata]

Honestly looks a lot like a buggy choke to me, but with the opponent's body inverted. It's not exactly an orthodox buggy choke from bottom side control but the same mechanics are in play.



Nicky Rod showed off a buggy choke from full guard in a roll prior to ADCC, the end looks alot like that choke but he's created seperation with his legs to make it tighter.

 

[shunyata]

Starts with a headlock & a bridge. Schiro blocks the bridge with base & stays in mount, but then he puts his hands in trying to fight off the headlock, & that's when Poclit traps an arm as well & is able to chase the scarf.



Keeps the arm & head control, throughout the scrambling.

As long as you keep those, you can be on bottom scarf and still dominate, sweep back to classic top scarf, or even submit, as we see here. Although a much more likely submission to attack from bottom scarf instead of this weird ass strangle, is the South Americana (Americana their arm using only your legs).

Played with that before (the leg americana from bottom side control with scarf mechanics) and had another brown belt going "WHAT THE FUCK?!??!". He bailed and wanted none of it, so I scrambled up to standing off it.

 

[NicholasJBasile]

Hopefully you can see the link. Poclit is in bottom mount, bridges out, and manages to catch Schiro in a deep head and arm scarf hold grip where he's holding onto his own leg. Schiro rolls out onto his knees (and feet), seemingly escaping any pin, but Poclit is still able to choke him unconscious with the scarf hold grip.

Can't say I've ever seen a finishing position like it. Here's just the finishing position, which really doesn't show that this was originally a standard scarf hold:

I will not even pretend to act like I've trained this move much less tried it haha Very neat finish.

 

[mattemate]

That's just an arm triangle with an identity crisis.