W&T General Discussion Thread

[Cubo de Sangre]

Instead of sticking random chatter into other threads, here's one where we can discuss whatever. Guns or otherwise. Just so happens this first post is gonna be a guns.

@Fungoose,

Interesting VZ-58 vid.




Sounds like the early D-Techniks (up through CZ's involvement) has original military parts, which would explain the desirability. I bought mine in late '08.

Still wish it had the bayonet lug. But hey, all the sudden I wanna buy stripper clips.

 

[Fungoose]

Mishaco is a wealth of information about former comblock imports. I haven’t had a chance to watch the video, but he certainly knows his shit. A buddy of mine offered me a big bag full of strippers the other day. If I had known you were looking I would have snatched them up!

 

[Cubo de Sangre]

Mishaco is a wealth of information about former comblock imports. I haven’t had a chance to watch the video, but he certainly knows his shit. A buddy of mine offered me a big bag full of strippers the other day. If I had known you were looking I would have snatched them up!

I just happened to stumble across the dude. Sure seems to know his shit.

Thanks. Was never interested in clips until watching the video. Not sure what he said that got me curious, but it was something.

 

[Fungoose]

I just happened to stumble across the dude. Sure seems to know his shit.

Mishaco vids are great. Both for the information and the unintentional comedy. He’s legally blind so his hair is always a mess, and his cats are always getting in the way of his videos. It adds a layer of humor to the videos.

Thanks. Was never interested in clips until watching the video. Not sure what he said that got me curious, but it was something.

The VZ-58 has a little guide on the bolt carrier that allows one to top charge the magazine with stripper clips, much like an SKS. I can’t really see it being a huge benefit, unless you were out of loaded magazines and needed some firepower quickly. Rather than releasing the magazine and reloading you could just charge it from the top with the strippers. It takes plenty of practice to become proficient with the movements though. I should see the guy again next weekend. Let me know if you’d like me grab those for you. They’d be free, excepting the actual shipping cost of getting them to you. Here’s another Mishaco video on the VZ-58 variants.

 

[Cubo de Sangre]

Mishaco vids are great. Both for the information and the unintentional comedy. He’s legally blind so his hair is always a mess, and his cats are always getting in the way of his videos. It adds a layer of humor to the videos.

The VZ-58 has a little guide on the bolt carrier that allows one to top charge the magazine with stripper clips, much like an SKS. I can’t really see it being a huge benefit, unless you were out of loaded magazines and needed some firepower quickly. Rather than releasing the magazine and reloading you could just charge it from the top with the strippers. It takes plenty of practice to become proficient with the movements though. I should see the guy again next weekend. Let me know if you’d like me grab those for you. They’d be free, excepting the actual shipping cost of getting them to you. Here’s another Mishaco video on the VZ-58 variants.

I was wondering what was up and thought how can a gun reviewer be blind. lol

I'd totally be down for those clips. Just let me know via PM. Thanks!! Two things about the VZ that could be better are the mag release and that it seems to heat up the handguard quickly. I'll check out the vid in a bit.

 

[Fungoose]

I was wondering what was up and thought how can a gun reviewer be blind. lol

I'd totally be down for those clips. Just let me know via PM. Thanks!! Two things about the VZ that could be better are the mag release and that it seems to heat up the handguard quickly. I'll check out the vid in a bit.

He’s legally, but not entirely, blind. He shoots in some of his videos. There was one where he was clipping the ends of some bushes (just a few feet from the barrel) with each shot. I don’t know if he knew the bushes were there or not, but it’s much more humorous to assume he didn’t. His knowledge and memory of import history is remarkable though, and he’s a really nice guy as well. I will PM you about the other.

 

[Cubo de Sangre]

@RerouteToRemain & @Roaming East,

When you cats build AR's to you ever lap the upper or do any bedding? I've only recently heard of these things possibly being of benefit.

 

[RerouteToRemain]

@RerouteToRemain & @Roaming East,

When you cats build AR's to you ever lap the upper or do any bedding? I've only recently heard of these things possibly being of benefit.

No, I've read about it in the past but personally didn't see the point. If tolerances were shit and the barrel slid into the upper with little force I'd probably consider it. Maybe it's worth it but idk. So far the most accurate round out of my precision build I did three 5 shot groups of .65 - .68 moa in a row. My 4th group I had 1 bad shot but 4 of the rounds were in a .5 moa group. I honestly don't expect much better. .5 moa is basically what I think the max capability of factory match ammo is. Unless I get better and hand load I think my consistent groups will be in the .5 - .8 moa range. Not sure if I lapped and bedded if the groups would get better or am I already near my skill or ammo threshold.

 

[Cubo de Sangre]

No, I've read about it in the past but personally didn't see the point. If tolerances were shit and the barrel slid into the upper with little force I'd probably consider it. Maybe it's worth it but idk. So far the most accurate round out of my precision build I did three 5 shot groups of .65 - .68 moa in a row. My 4th group I had 1 bad shot but 4 of the rounds were in a .5 moa group. I honestly don't expect much better. .5 moa is basically what I think the max capability of factory match ammo is. Unless I get better and hand load I think my consistent groups will be in the .5 - .8 moa range. Not sure if I lapped and bedded if the groups would get better or am I already near my skill or ammo threshold.

This thread got me interested.

https://www.ar15.com/forums/General/Is-there-a-real-benefit-to-squaring-uppers-/5-2214432/

 

[Roaming East]

@RerouteToRemain & @Roaming East,

When you cats build AR's to you ever lap the upper or do any bedding? I've only recently heard of these things possibly being of benefit.

negative. If i had an upper and lower that had a bunch of play or a barrel that didnt sit true, i just wouldnt use them. I do get customers that are super prickly about matching receiver sets but none have ever asked me to do work like that.

 

[Cubo de Sangre]

negative. If i had an upper and lower that had a bunch of play or a barrel that didnt sit true, i just wouldnt use them. I do get customers that are super prickly about matching receiver sets but none have ever asked me to do work like that.

Makes sense. In regards to uppers "needing" squared, a dude posted this pic. Makes me think there's something to this.

 

[RerouteToRemain]

Makes sense. In regards to uppers "needing" squared, a dude posted this pic. Makes me think there's something to this.

Well I'd at least be curious to check all my future upper purchases now.

 

[Cubo de Sangre]

Well I'd at least be curious to check all my future upper purchases now.

I know I am. When it comes to uppers I tend to be a budget purchaser.

 

[Roaming East]

thats what barrel nut shims are for. getting the PROPER torque is the key to barrel alignment a lot of the time. Most of the 'my gun aint shooting straight' issues we see at my shop are dudes hand cranking their barrels in fucking up the gas tube and handguard alignment, putting directional stress on everything.

 

[Cubo de Sangre]

thats what barrel nut shims are for. getting the PROPER torque is the key to barrel alignment a lot of the time. Most of the 'my gun aint shooting straight' issues we see at my shop are dudes hand cranking their barrels in fucking up the gas tube and handguard alignment, putting directional stress on everything.

How many pounds of torque are we talkin'?

 

[Roaming East]

How many pounds of torque are we talkin'?

generally about 40lbs will do it. close to 60 for Giesselli and SLR stuff cause of the fit. I see guys do 'body weigh' torque where they brace the wrench against the body and leverage it. thats a big no. but its slightly better than the goons who loctite everything i suppose.

 

[Gregolian]

Sssssoooooo.... my new job is in Salt Lake City at their County District Attorney Office... guess what's like... 3 blocks away from work for me now?

http://gallensonsguns.com/

FUCK. My increase in pay is going to go like nowhere isn't it?

 

[Cubo de Sangre]

generally about 40lbs will do it. close to 60 for Giesselli and SLR stuff cause of the fit. I see guys do 'body weigh' torque where they brace the wrench against the body and leverage it. thats a big no. but its slightly better than the goons who loctite everything i suppose.

Sorry, I meant how much is way over-torqued such that it causes problems. Specs say to 80lbs so I'd imagine it would have to be well past that.

Sssssoooooo.... my new job is in Salt Lake City at their County District Attorney Office... guess what's like... 3 blocks away from work for me now?

http://gallensonsguns.com/

FUCK. My increase in pay is going to go like nowhere isn't it?

Congrats on finally finding a new gig. Looks like a cool gun store. Good luck!!

 

[Fungoose]

Beginning of a 5000 round test of the VZ-58. He gives a shoutout to Mishaco at the beginning of the video.

 

[Cubo de Sangre]

Beginning of a 5000 round test of the VZ-58. He gives a shoutout to Mishaco at the beginning of the video.

When the 7.62x39 AR build is done I'll take the VZ out with it and compare.

Thanks again for the stripper clips. For anyone reading, this gentleman was kind enough to hook me up out of the goodness of his own heart. Shipped on his own dime. Now that's a W&T Sherbro.