Why have gamers become so entitled?

[jojoRed]

I didn’t say free. I said it won’t cost you a penny more than you’re currently paying.

I personally paid $28 for my last annual sub. In 2020 my most played game was Fall Guys. I got 80 hours out of that. The value I get from the included games and digital discounts pays for itself several times over.

Sure, but youre still payin for a product. I dont think its entitlement for people to want the industry standard for the game they get with the subscription [a subscription they paid for]. Its still a game that the consumer 'purchased' for a certain time.

I also think PS+ is amazing value on paper, in reality, I play maybe 3-4 of the games out of a year. I assume this is the case for millions of people [including my some of my friends].

I couldnt give a rats ass about the upgrade, but to say the people that do, are entitled or an overreaction is not fair. I can see it from their viewpoint. Square Enix is clearly takin part in some anti-consumer shit. Especially with the DLC nonsense. Just greed.

 

[Dizzy]

Sure, but youre still payin for a product. I dont think its entitlement for people to want the industry standard for the game they get with the subscription [a subscription they paid for]. Its still a game that the consumer 'purchased' for a certain time.

I also think PS+ is amazing value on paper, in reality, I play maybe 3-4 of the games out of a year. I assume this is the case for millions of people [including my some of my friends].

I couldnt give a rats ass about the upgrade, but to say the people that do, are entitled or an overreaction is not fair. I can see it from their viewpoint. Square Enix is clearly takin part in some anti-consumer shit. Especially with the DLC nonsense. Just greed.

Oh it’s absolutely entitlement. The game goes for $30 as is. It’s been out less than a year. If I didn’t already own that game it would have paid for my sub entirely just with that. Why does anyone deserve to have a game that will retail at $70 for nothing? Sure it would be cool if they did, but no one is owed that. It’s an additional benefit to a service. No one is getting “deep dicked here.”

I’ve been playing and enjoying Control, $40 game and we’re only getting into March.

It’s a tremendous value no matter how you slice it. There are enough genres that get included that everyone should be able to find some games they enjoy out of it and even if by some miracle you can’t, there’s always the digital discounts.

 

[Deleted member 263856]

I've been gaming for 30 years now and I have never seen the gaming community so entitled as they are now.

Last week we had a Nintendo direct and there were a few interesting games but nothing too major. I think it is safe to say that Japan is less equipped than America to deal with the work at home situation.

Last night we had a state of play that got ripped to shreds by the online community. Personally, I thought it was fine. Sony came out and released a statement previously that the state of play was to focus on game's from June 2020's presentation. I personally loved the FF7R announcement, I'm hyped to go back and play again along with the DLC.

Even outside of these two events there is nonstop bitching about how games should be free, how every game should be AAA.

Each time an indie is shown people mock it and call it trash yet I find those games to be some of the most creative and fun even over AAA games.

I've never seen this growing up as much, people were grateful for the games they were getting and we had great conversations about games. Now, nothing ever seems to be good enough for people.

What has changed?

It's just a part of a broader issue. Kids are growing up in an instant gratification culture. It's not so much gamers as it is everybody.

 

[jojoRed]

Oh it’s absolutely entitlement. The game goes for $30 as is. It’s been out less than a year. If I didn’t already own that game it would have paid for my sub entirely just with that. Why does anyone deserve to have a game that will retail at $70 for nothing? Sure it would be cool if they did, but no one is owed that. It’s an additional benefit to a service. No one is getting “deep dicked here.”

The publisher can charge whatever they want, and they can set the terms, but a consumer, who purchases a game/subscription cant ask to have more for their money? Especially in a case were its more or less industry standard to have PS5 upgrades being free.

You mentioned Control. The did the PS4 to PS5 upgrade for free for their game and that was last month's PS+ game. The consumer cant want the same thing for FF7? How is that entitlement? Wanting something thats standard is not entitlement, its expected.

Oh and Square Enix is deep dicking all the PS4 only owners who bought the game for the PS4. Now if they want to play a DLC of a game they like and supported, they gotta somehow find a 499 dollar console [thats near impossible to find at MSRP], to have the privilege of purchasing the DLC? I dont see how thats not deep dicking.

 

[Dizzy]

The publisher can charge whatever they want, and they can set the terms, but a consumer, who purchases a game/subscription cant ask to have more for their money? Especially in a case were its more or less industry standard to have PS5 upgrades being free.

You mentioned Control. The did the PS4 to PS5 upgrade for free for their game and that was last month's PS+ game. The consumer cant want the same thing for FF7? How is that entitlement? Wanting something thats standard is not entitlement, its expected.

Oh and Square Enix is deep dicking all the PS4 only owners who bought the game for the PS4. Now if they want to play a DLC of a game they like and supported, they gotta somehow find a 499 dollar console [thats near impossible to find at MSRP], to have the privilege of purchasing the DLC? I dont see how thats not deep dicking.

You can want whatever you’d like. It’s when you throw a fit when you don’t get it that comes across as entitled.

You’re talking about a campaign DLC as getting dicked over because it’s not free? Yeah, that’s ridiculous. They provided a 40+ hour game for $60 and you’re upset because they’re asking for more for more content?

edit: my mistake, you’re talking about it not being available on PS4. It seems like they shifted their focus to the console they’re currently developing on. They’d make a lot more money if they made it for the PS4, don’t you think? If it’s just about greed.

 

[rob mafia]

There's a fine line between the two, though. Gamers are unreasonable in a lot of instances. Look at the "Cyberpunk" fiasco for instance. CDPR announces a few delays, and the pitchforks come out. Then they just go, "Okay fine. Fuck it. Here's your game that you would not tolerate another delay for". Then it comes out half finished, and those same people who were bitching about all the delays are all "They should've just delayed it. Why didn't they delay it? Fucking idiots!"

You're damned if you do, damned if you don't in a lot of cases, because a lot of gamers are in fact very entitled with little to no patience at all. Their mantra is "Gimme, gimmie, gimmie! Now, now now! Oh' and it better be perfect in every way imaginable, or it's the worst thing ever and you're the worst developer ever, and I hope you out of business for ruining my life."

Not everyone of course, but the core of the base....yeah, lots of unreasonable, entitled man babies.

to be fair, cdpr is the one that put out the release dates, promos, etc. it's not gamers' fault that cdpr jumped the gun, themselves, to milk them.

and also, outright lying about the state of the game.

 

[Plissken]

So many are of the bitchass trophy for last place generation and never received the belt when they deserved it but instead had their parents try to appease them. Combine that with the constant entertainment options and instant gratification having the internet on a phone you can carry in your pocket and social media and patience is a lost virtue to many.

 

[GtehMVP]

I dont know why gamers are being isolated as bitching babies, every industry has them. It's easy to whine and complain and it's profitable for social media influencers to do so. People also love a good "us vs them" dynamic.

Social media has brought out the worst in us.

 

[BjPenn2017]

It’s a combination of multiple things, personally my problem with games as a whole is the lack of innovation, and the people who are so willing to bend over and take it dry. Companies like Ubisoft, EA and even Rockstar (although they make solid games) have found a formula between yearly releases/updates and micro transactions that works and they are sticking to it and going down swinging with it.

That rests on the consoomer and the government a bit though. As long as they know they can keep releasing dog crap games with full on gambling systems that dummies buy year in year out, or low effort re skinned open world games that basically cost them nothing but advertising cost and make them tons they’re gonna keep doing it.

Why do you think you’re seeing so many remasters of games no one really asked for nowadays? Because it is cheap, and it is a formula they have become all to familiar with and have been resting on for years now anyway.

 

[Morning Star]

Sorry, this sub is about as deep as I go into gaming culture tbh. I used to go to Gamespot or IGN daily but I realized IGN was just Buzzfeed with all the stupid lists and clickbaity articles. Gametrailers was my favorite but I just don't like them the same now that they are a YouTube channel only.

Are people really demanding games for free? That's insane if true. And yeah I agree with you if that's the case.

However, I get why gamers would be pissed about something like Cyberpunk. Or the annual reskinned EA/Ubisoft annual offering with all the microtransactions.

I also understand why they'd be upset about the new systems. Seriously what an uninspiring launch. I can't remember a time I've been less interested in video games.

 

[jojoRed]

You can want whatever you’d like. It’s when you throw a fit when you don’t get it that comes across as entitled.

I disagree. In some cases, its warranted for the kids to throw fits.

edit: my mistake, you’re talking about it not being available on PS4. It seems like they shifted their focus to the console they’re currently developing on. They’d make a lot more money if they made it for the PS4, don’t you think? If it’s just about greed.

Oh its definitely greed.

DLCs dont generally sell as well as the base game...so the revenue generated will never be as high as selling the game on the PS5 again.
The DLC is free for anyone who buys a PS5 copy.
But then anyone with a PS4 will need to purchase a PS5 copy to receive the DLC for FREE or buy a whole new console for the ability to purchase the DLC....making their sales figures look good on the PS5. They for sure have targets on the PS5, with Sony, giving out extra %'s the more consoles/games it sells.

Its basic economics.

You think the sales team sat down and intentionally said 'lets not have the DLC on th PS4' because theyre not greedy?

 

[GearSolidMetal]

What has changed?

Because we now know what the gaming industry is capable of.

Awesome games like The Last of Us, Mass Effect 2, Witcher 3, (fill in the blank), (fill in the blank), and (fill in the blank).

Everyone's Top 10 best games ever are the gold standard for every gamer. Every game we play afterward are compared to them, and every preview/trailer for an upcoming game sets an expectation for a final product that will be compared to those Top 10 favorite games.

That, and the amount of online criticism has skyrocketed, for better or worse.

 

[Dizzy]

I disagree. In some cases, its warranted for the kids to throw fits.

Oh its definitely greed.

DLCs dont generally sell as well as the base game...so the revenue generated will never be as high as selling the game on the PS5 again.
The DLC is free for anyone who buys a PS5 copy.
But then anyone with a PS4 will need to purchase a PS5 copy to receive the DLC for FREE or buy a whole new console for the ability to purchase the DLC....making their sales figures look good on the PS5. They for sure have targets on the PS5, with Sony, giving out extra %'s the more consoles/games it sells.

Its basic economics.

You think the sales team sat down and intentionally said 'lets not have the DLC on th PS4' because theyre not greedy?

I think you’re trolling at this point. The game has sold over 5 million copies on the PS4. That’s a huge install base that you can sell the DLC to especially since not many people own a PS5. It would absolutely make more sense to sell to both markets.

The PS5 edition that’s launching in June is like a “complete edition” that studios release all the time. If you’re late to the party and don’t own the PS4 version and you really want all the content in one package then it can make sense to buy. But there’s nothing saying that once Integrade launches you can no longer upgrade your PS4 copy. So if anyone really wanted to they could get a copy of the PS4 version and whenever they get a PS5, upgrade for free and buy the DLC if they choose.

I don’t think a DLC campaign with Yuffie is going to be a PS5 system seller.

 

[jojoRed]

I think you’re trolling at this point. The game has sold over 5 million copies on the PS4. That’s a huge install base that you can sell the DLC to especially since not many people own a PS5. It would absolutely make more sense to sell to both markets.

The PS5 edition that’s launching in June is like a “complete edition” that studios release all the time. If you’re late to the party and don’t own the PS4 version and you really want all the content in one package then it can make sense to buy. But there’s nothing saying that once Integrade launches you can no longer upgrade your PS4 copy. So if anyone really wanted to they could get a copy of the PS4 version and whenever they get a PS5, upgrade for free and buy the DLC if they choose.

I don’t think a DLC campaign with Yuffie is going to be a PS5 system seller.

Im trolling because I understand economics?

Square has a deal with Sony. These deals usually include targets. Why is this hard to understand? The proportion of people who buy DLC is miniscule compared to the sale of a full game. Enticing people to buy a PS5 to purchase a copy of the DLC, not only looks good from a revenue stand point, but they would make more money from Sony [due to sales bonuses that comes with first party games].


There's a reason they decided to just release the DLC for the PS5 only.......again why is this difficult to understand?

Selling fewer copies of something at full price >>>> selling a lot of copies of something at a low price.

Here is how something like this would be discussed in meetings. The DLC is probably going to be 4.99, based on the FFXV DLCs, if [im overselling], 750,000 sales are made on the PS4, that around a 3.8mill in revenue.

If a 100,000 copies [hugely underselling] of the PS5 version is sold at 70, that a 7mill revenue. The DLC could entice people to choose going for the superior version on the PS5 rather than buying a PS4 copy.

For those that have a PS4 copy and want to buy a PS5, they'd need to purchase a new PS5 and then purchase the DLC on the PS5...Since theyve got a deal with Sony, they pay less to Sony whilst also getting more for hitting targets on the PS5.

They can report back to their shareholders about the awesome financials and sales for the PS5.....in turn increasing stock prices.

If using critical thinking and previous knowledge of how business is done is trolling, then yes I am a troll.

 

[Dizzy]

Im trolling because I understand economics?

Square has a deal with Sony. These deals usually include targets. Why is this hard to understand? The proportion of people who buy DLC is miniscule compared to the sale of a full game. Enticing people to buy a PS5 to purchase a copy of the DLC, not only looks good from a revenue stand point, but they would make more money from Sony [due to sales bonuses that comes with first party games].


There's a reason they decided to just release the DLC for the PS5 only.......again why is this difficult to understand?

Selling fewer copies of something at full price >>>> selling a lot of copies of something at a low price.

Here is how something like this would be discussed in meetings. The DLC is probably going to be 4.99, based on the FFXV DLCs, if [im overselling], 750,000 sales are made on the PS4, that around a 3.8mill in revenue.

If a 100,000 copies [hugely underselling] of the PS5 version is sold at 70, that a 7mill revenue. The DLC could entice people to choose going for the superior version on the PS5 rather than buying a PS4 copy.

For those that have a PS4 copy and want to buy a PS5, they'd need to purchase a new PS5 and then purchase the DLC on the PS5...Since theyve got a deal with Sony, they pay less to Sony whilst also getting more for hitting targets on the PS5.

They can report back to their shareholders about the awesome financials and sales for the PS5.....in turn increasing stock prices.

If using critical thinking and previous knowledge of how business is done is trolling, then yes I am a troll.

Yes, people are just waiting for the Yuffie DLC to drop before they buy a PS5 lol.

Your argument holds no weight because the PS5’s will sell regardless of FF7 DLC and Square is allowing people to upgrade their PS4 copies.

People will still buy copies of the PS4 version to upgrade later. People will still buy PS4 copies and never upgrade, or at least not for years, and they’d be missing out on that revenue.

Development has clearly shifted to the PS5 exclusively which is why the sequel will launch there and the DLC is launching there.

 

[jojoRed]

Yes, people are just waiting for the Yuffie DLC to drop before they buy a PS5 lol.

Your argument holds no weight because the PS5’s will sell regardless of FF7 DLC and Square is allowing people to upgrade their PS4 copies.

People will still buy copies of the PS4 version to upgrade later. People will still buy PS4 copies and never upgrade, or at least not for years, and they’d be missing out on that revenue.

Development has clearly shifted to the PS5 exclusively which is why the sequel will launch there and the DLC is launching there.

You focused on 1 point.

I mentioned several.

The DLC and the superior PS5 version bein 70 bux. If someone new wanted to play the FF7, theyd want to buy that version instead of the PS4 version with the PS5 upgrade [thats 35 bux]. Consumers will always go for the best, easiest and quickest choice, but this also nets SE more revenue. Not selling the DLC on the console they sold more copies on is also anti consumer. I dont see why a fan needs to pay for a new 499 console to play a DLC.

But if youre not understanding, I cba, and I dont care to explain anymore.

 

[Dizzy]

You focused on 1 point.

I mentioned several.

The DLC and the superior PS5 version bein 70 bux. If someone new wanted to play the FF7, theyd want to buy that version instead of the PS4 version with the PS5 upgrade [thats 35 bux]. Consumers will always go for the best, easiest and quickest choice, but this also nets SE more revenue. Not selling the DLC on the console they sold more copies on is also anti consumer. I dont see why a fan needs to pay for a new 499 console to play a DLC.

But if youre not understanding, I cba, and I dont care to explain anymore.

No I get the point you’re trying to make. It just doesn’t make any sense. It would hold water if Square stopped the free upgrade plan. You also severely understated how much that DLC will go for. Square isn’t selling anything for $5 lol. That DLC is going to be between $10-$20.

It’s much more logical that they would have focused all new development on the console they’re actually developing on and calling it a day.

 

[Law Talkin’ Guy]

Gaming is all about instant gratification. That leads to gamers becoming a bunch of Veruca Salts

 

[My Spot]

I kinda miss being a kid and not caring about FPS or resolution. All you had were magazines and gossip on the playground during recess. Kids today with their instant gratification and smart phones and Youtubes...

 

[HairdewX]

Gametrailers was my favorite but I just don't like them the same now that they are a YouTube channel only.

The Gametrailer guys left and started Easy Allies years ago. They still produce great stuff and you can tell they love games.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCZrxXp1reP8E353rZsB3jaA