Movies Better Director: Sam Raimi vs Tim Burton

[I Fusion I]

Those are valid enough views imo. Both batman and Spiderman 1 and 2 are great movies, I could see how people could prefer either. I feel like the Raimi spiderman movies get some unfair hate. They capture the spirit of the character incredibly well.

Nobody hates or criticizes first two of Raimi. The third get some flack because while not being a bad film, it has its flaws.

It is the same (to a lesser degree) for TDKR compared to the first two Nolan's Batman films. Because it's simply a more flawed film but still very good overall.

Note; I've made a thread regarding these two films before; I enjoy both films.

https://forums.sherdog.com/threads/...nd-spider-man-3-are-underrated.4215194/page-3

But the flaws of SM3 are harder to overlook so I can’t give it more than a decent score as a fan of the character.

 

[Mike]

Nobody hates or criticizes first two of Raimi. The third get some flack because while not being a bad film, it has its flaws.

It is the same (to a lesser degree) for TDKR compared to the first two Nolan's Batman films. Because it's simply a more flawed film but still very good overall.

Note; I've made a thread regarding these two films before; I enjoy both films.

https://forums.sherdog.com/threads/...nd-spider-man-3-are-underrated.4215194/page-3

But the flaws of SM3 are harder to overlook so I can’t give it more than a decent score as a fan of the character.

There was some criticism of that trilogy in general being cheesy. This is all in hindsight though, only the 3rd was criticized when it came out. Justifiably so, it isn't very good.

 

[Patrick Jane]

Sam Raimi is underrated. Tim Burton is rated exactly right.

 

[I Fusion I]

There was some criticism of that trilogy in general being cheesy. This is all in hindsight though, only the 3rd was criticized when it came out. Justifiably so, it isn't very good.

It is a mix of being cheesy, fun but it has also it's serious moments. I think people just either grew up with it or didn’t find it amazing compared to MCU films.

I mean, it has it's flaws and I think Tobey Maguire is outshined by the villain in all three films despite being well written but it works well overall as a trilogy.

Better character work than both MCU and amazing spider man movies.

 

[John Mabrey]

Those are valid enough views imo. Both batman and Spiderman 1 and 2 are great movies, I could see how people could prefer either. I feel like the Raimi spiderman movies get some unfair hate. They capture the spirit of the character incredibly well.

Only the third one gets much hate imo

 

[John Mabrey]

Most ppl prolly prefer the first 2 Spiderman's over any of the Holland ones

 

[John Mabrey]

It is a mix of being cheesy, fun but it has also it's serious moments. I think people just either grew up with it or didn’t find it amazing compared to MCU films.

I mean, it has it's flaws and I think Tobey Maguire is outshined by the villain in all three films despite being well written but it works well overall as a trilogy.

Better character work than both MCU and amazing spider man movies.

I liked the first 2 Tobey Spiderman's more than most of the mcu movies tbh

 

[John Mabrey]

It is a mix of being cheesy, fun but it has also it's serious moments. I think people just either grew up with it or didn’t find it amazing compared to MCU films.

I mean, it has it's flaws and I think Tobey Maguire is outshined by the villain in all three films despite being well written but it works well overall as a trilogy.

Better character work than both MCU and amazing spider man movies.

It's not as cheesy as the current mcu movies pattern of inserting stupid jokes into every other scene

 

[Scrody]

Sam Raimi. More range imo

 

[I Fusion I]

I liked the first 2 Tobey Spiderman's more than most of the mcu movies tbh

Only ones I like more are Infinity War, civil war, winter soldier and iron man. Rest: spider man films are better.

It's not as cheesy as the current mcu movies pattern of inserting stupid jokes into every other scene

Different target and style though, might do a thread about Spider-Man 2 now that I think twice

 

[Mike]

It is a mix of being cheesy, fun but it has also it's serious moments. I think people just either grew up with it or didn’t find it amazing compared to MCU films.

I mean, it has it's flaws and I think Tobey Maguire is outshined by the villain in all three films despite being well written but it works well overall as a trilogy.

Better character work than both MCU and amazing spider man movies.

Unlike a lot of mcu movies the Spiderman films have some really great villains. So I don't think that's too much of a knock on Tobey. He plays the character well imo and seems to have an intuitive sense of the tone Raimi is going for, and seamlessly fits that tone.

 

[I Fusion I]

Unlike a lot of mcu movies the Spiderman films have some really great villains. So I don't think that's too much of a knock on Tobey. He plays the character well imo and seems to have an intuitive sense of the tone Raimi is going for, and seamlessly fits that tone.

I do agree about that, i even liked Sandman.

It does fit well, but i personally think the "cheesy" stuff revolves mostly about Maguire's acting. I mean Emo Parker has plenty of memes lol

I like MCU films btw, but they're mostly studio-driven and not director vision which is something other filmmakers like Del Toro, Nolan, Burton and Raimi had.

 

[Mike]

I do agree about that, i even liked Sandman.

It does fit well, but i personally think the "cheesy" stuff revolves mostly about Maguire's acting. I mean Emo Parker has plenty of memes lol

I like MCU films btw, but they're mostly studio-driven and not director vision which is something other filmmakers like Del Toro, Nolan, Burton and Raimi had.

I don't blame him for emo Peter. As it's written he wasn't given much to work with. A rare misstep in that trilogy. I love the MCU films but there is definitely a formula there in order to keep everything cohesive, so I can understand why some don't like that.

There's something so earnest and kindhearted and whimsical about the Raimi movies, that imo beautifully captures the tone of silver era Spiderman comics while adapting to the early 2000s. There's a real sense of joy and hope in the world and the characters that some find cheesy, but I find to be incredibly authentic to the essence of the character.

 

[I Fusion I]

I don't blame him for emo Peter. As it's written he wasn't given much to work with. A rare misstep in that trilogy. I love the MCU films but there is definitely a formula there in order to keep everything cohesive, so I can understand why some don't like that.

There's something so earnest and kindhearted and whimsical about the Raimi movies, that imo beautifully captures the tone of silver era Spiderman comics while adapting to the early 2000s. There's a real sense of joy and hope in the world and the characters that some find cheesy, but I find to be incredibly authentic to the essence of the character.

I know about the formula and that directors are hired; it works because they’re enterteining blockbusters so it’s ok to not aim for higher.

I agree on that.

 

[Mike]

I know about the formula and that directors are hired; it works because they’re enterteining blockbusters so it’s ok to not aim for higher.

I agree on that.

I think people have the idea that a formula means you can't have truly great movies. I dunno if I agree with that. Some of the movies that were very good to some of the best ever in the genre imo:

Avengers
Iron Man
Infinity War
End Game
Captain America: TWS
Captain America: Civil War
GOTG
GOTG 2
Thor Ragnarok
Doctor Strange

 

[I Fusion I]

I think people have the idea that a formula means you can't have truly great movies. I dunno if I agree with that. Some of the movies that were very good to some of the best ever in the genre imo:

Avengers
Iron Man
Infinity War
End Game
Captain America: TWS
Captain America: Civil War
GOTG
GOTG 2
Thor Ragnarok
Doctor Strange

Do you like Nolan's Batman films and Joker? These ones are dark and gritty but without looking like BvS and MoS which tend to be more funny than serious.

Yeah, I like all of the ones you listed. But the story structure for origin stories in the MCU hasn’t changed a little though

 

[Mike]

Do you like Nolan's Batman films and Joker? These ones are dark and gritty but without looking like BvS and MoS which tend to be more funny than serious.

Yeah, I like all of the ones you listed. But the story structure for origin stories in the MCU hasn’t changed a little though

I think Begins and TDK rank among the best in the genre. I didn't like TDKR very much. Joker was entertaining but I feel like it's a bit overrated. I dont see it as a masterpiece like some do. I hated MOS, BVS, the first suicide squad, and justice League. I thought Shazam was pretty good though.


I do agree that marvels origin movies are usually the weakest, with the exception of iron man and gotg. They also struggle with having villains that feel like a real threat.

 

[I Fusion I]

I think Begins and TDK rank among the best in the genre. I didn't like TDKR very much. Joker was entertaining but I feel like it's a bit overrated. I dont see it as a masterpiece like some do. I hated MOS, BVS, the first suicide squad, and justice League. I thought Shazam was pretty good though.


I do agree that marvels origin movies are usually the weakest, with the exception of iron man and gotg. They also struggle with having villains that feel like a real threat.

Shazam, WW and Gunn's Suicide Squad are good films. Aquaman is decent but rest of DCEU is all bad films.

I'd say Joker is not a masterpiece but a great film overall. I'd give it an 8 just like Rises.

Exactly. I just feel they are straight forward and too safe. The sequels are usually better than the first ones in that case for almost ALL superhero trilogies.

 

[Mike]

Shazam, WW and Gunn's Suicide Squad are good films. Aquaman is decent but rest of DCEU is all bad films.

I'd say Joker is not a masterpiece but a great film overall. I'd give it an 8 just like Rises.

Exactly. I just feel they are straight forward and too safe. The sequels are usually better than the first ones in that case for almost ALL superhero trilogies.

I think 8 is around where I had Joker as well. The origin movies are even worse if you're familiar with the characters as there's absolutely nothing new or interesting. Very by the numbers. Unsurprisingly the ones that break that trend, iron man and gotg, are also their best origin movies. I'd throw ant man and dr strange in that group as well.

 

[I Fusion I]

I think 8 is around where I had Joker as well. The origin movies are even worse if you're familiar with the characters as there's absolutely nothing new or interesting. Very by the numbers. Unsurprisingly the ones that break that trend, iron man and gotg, are also their best origin movies. I'd throw ant man and dr strange in that group as well.

What do you think about the rest; Dunkirk, Inception, Interstellar, Prestige and Memento?

I used to read comics and I like superhero stuff so of course they are pretty much by the numbers and cookie cutter like Captain America one which is enterteining but has zero rewatch value compared to its sequels.