BJJ for Self Defense : what do you REALLY need ?

[sb413197]

I dont think playing guard is a good idea in self defense. I mean we do train to intercept arm during punches (and lock up triangle ) but frankly slamming isnt allowed in BJJ but sure as hell gonna happen in a street fight. Guard just seems to leave you open to strikes too especially against an aggressive attacker ?

Couldn't disagree more. It doesn't mean you should usually (if ever) go there by choice, but it's absolutely crucial to know your way around the guard in case you end up on the ground unintentionally as a result of a wild scramble, slipping, if you get tripped/knocked down, or any other reason. Particularly knowing your away around standard open guard (feet on the hips with your opponent standing), closed guard, and half guard...being a spider guard expert or being on your 1-leg-X game may be a bit less important.

Knowing how to quickly hit a sweep or get back to your feet, and defend yourself, is arguably one of the most important reasons to learn BJJ - definitely one of the things MMA fighters seek from learning it too as few are as good off their back as a BJJ player.

 

[Russky]

self defense in real life situations.

Like a school fight?

 

[shunyata]

osotogari
more osotogari
rnc

To clarify this I would generally summarize that to use BJJ for self defense one should have:

1) a BJJ top game
2) BJJ for mma style standup game to get off the ground (literally standing up from guards)
3) Judo. Nuff fucking said you'll need a standing clinch game and takedowns. Wrestling will also do.
4) boxing, or at the very least a passable jab.

There's certainly more but that would be the basics.

 

[Blake_UK]

I've been focusing so much on getting breimbolos in live sparring lately but realized how far removed I'm getting from what was (or is) my main motivation for learning BJJ, and that is self defense in real life situations.

Obviously trying a breimbolo in a street fight will get my face stomped thru the ground, but what in your opinion is REALLY all you need to be very capable in a self defense situation? For me it doesn't seem like you need very much:

1) a simple and quick takedown to get fight ti ground with minimal risk to you getting hit and possibly KOd. *** THIS IS MY BIGGEST HOLE***

2) side control fundamentals, and knee slide transition to either knee on belly (if perp has friends around), or full mount (if he doesn't)

3) ability to maintain full mount on even the largest opponent. This is easier said than done as extremely large or strong people can potentially just literally lift you off and chuck you .

4) a basic sub from mount , armbar if they stick hands out , if for some reason they dont and keep arms tucked in (unlikely ), do basic gift wrap to transition to back mount (easy to do even with biggest guys ), and get a basic rnc .

I think really that's it. That's all you need.

I dont think playing guard is a good idea in self defense. I mean we do train to intercept arm during punches (and lock up triangle ) but frankly slamming isnt allowed in BJJ but sure as hell gonna happen in a street fight. Guard just seems to leave you open to strikes too especially against an aggressive attacker ?

But by far my biggest hole is lack of takedowns. Even in the gi all I can barely do is pull guard. Nogi takedowns is below hopeless and I tend to do this awkward slide into butterly hooks which in a street fight scenario will get me killed right away.

Your thoughts ?

1) Sounds like you should try some judo or wrestling.

2) If you’ve got someone in side mount just knee them in the side/elbow the throat/headbutt etc.

3) Unless you are seriously skilled (like B.B. level) and/or very strong it’s simply not going to happen in real life.

4) Fine if it’s 1vs1 and help is coming. Otherwise be prepared to break their arm etc.

My advice is learn to box, learn some judo/wrestling takedowns and lift weights.

 

[Ronald]

I've been focusing so much on getting breimbolos in live sparring lately but realized how far removed I'm getting from what was (or is) my main motivation for learning BJJ, and that is self defense in real life situations.

Obviously trying a breimbolo in a street fight will get my face stomped thru the ground, but what in your opinion is REALLY all you need to be very capable in a self defense situation? For me it doesn't seem like you need very much:

1) a simple and quick takedown to get fight ti ground with minimal risk to you getting hit and possibly KOd. *** THIS IS MY BIGGEST HOLE***

2) side control fundamentals, and knee slide transition to either knee on belly (if perp has friends around), or full mount (if he doesn't)

3) ability to maintain full mount on even the largest opponent. This is easier said than done as extremely large or strong people can potentially just literally lift you off and chuck you .

4) a basic sub from mount , armbar if they stick hands out , if for some reason they dont and keep arms tucked in (unlikely ), do basic gift wrap to transition to back mount (easy to do even with biggest guys ), and get a basic rnc .

I think really that's it. That's all you need.

I dont think playing guard is a good idea in self defense. I mean we do train to intercept arm during punches (and lock up triangle ) but frankly slamming isnt allowed in BJJ but sure as hell gonna happen in a street fight. Guard just seems to leave you open to strikes too especially against an aggressive attacker ?

But by far my biggest hole is lack of takedowns. Even in the gi all I can barely do is pull guard. Nogi takedowns is below hopeless and I tend to do this awkward slide into butterly hooks which in a street fight scenario will get me killed right away.

Your thoughts ?

I think all fundamental Jiu Jitsu techniques are important for such purpose. However, they aren’t enough. Either due to the limited atmosphere in which the sparring tend to occur - with many restrictions - or due to the lack of an accurate set of atemi techniques, also needed to achieve a full level of preparedness. Yet, quite frankly, many Jiu jitsu techniques of self defense group are not even feasible to be used against an opponent minimally trained in any martial arts or combat sports.

regards

 

[RemyR]

Honestly the biggest thing a BJJ guy needs for self defense is takedowns from the clinch. If a blue belt lands on top position on someone that doesn’t train that fight is pretty much over barring a freakish size difference.

And for the love of god don’t forget that just because you might train without strikes doesn’t mean you shouldn’t use strikes to set up a takedown, pass, or choke.

 

[Aaaay1hotsauce]

What do you need ?

For one thing you are not likely to get into a street fight unless you are searching for one.

Two, vs a non fighter a takedown, pass, gp approach is a you need. Maia is the blueprint that this strategy works on a high level.

Eh, GnP is a little dangerous. You can kill someone. I'm not a tough guy. But, I got into a bar fight (guy started it) many years ago. I clocked him, mounted him and pounded away (pre-training days). Did a lot of damage and got Ag Assault charge. Tried to get me to settle for a year. I wound up doing no jail time, but it was skin of my teeth. What i did lose was a lot of hair and a shit ton of money in lawyer fees.

Takedown, mount, pins the arms. If he's not a retard he'll beg you to let him up and you maybe should. If he is a retard you could throw on a kimura or a key lock. Could also go to triple threat, pin the near arm and just slap on a kimura. It's really effective in self defense. People get horrified and it obviously hurts a lot. Of course, once you mount him he'll likely do everything in his power to give you his back (kind of a natural defense). Then you can slap on a RNC and just put him to sleep. Another option is just a simple trip to kimura or even standing kimura. Could even get someone to chill out with a wrist lock (AIKIDO!). I know some cops who use them. Obviously, could be dangerous. Realistically, if you're a blue belt you should be able to takedown, pass and mount with ease. From there, there's really no threat. You forget how shitty people are at grappling when they have zero grappling experience.

I do wonder why people practice Berimbolo shit. I get that a lot of stuff we do has no practical use, but there's a line for me. And that line is basically giving my opponent a N-S position.

 

[Chungungo]

Just keep it simple, if the takedown or throw doesn´t knock the hell of the guy just ground and pound or run if you have the chance, just let go that pulling guard or sitting mentality for self defense.

 

[Chandler sama]

To be honest I think this whole mindset is wrong. Unless you have a fight scheduled on the playground next month, there is no reason to find a shortcut to beating people. Instead of 1 technique that works on people that are untrained and unathletic, why not have 5-10 techniques that work on trained, explosive, knowledgeable people? There is no reason to set the bar so low. Just train Judo or wrestling and you'll learn a number of techniques and you'll have confidence that they will work even on skilled people. Of course you don't have to quit BJJ, but training once a week in standing grappling, striking, etc can help. Why not be the best that you can be and really learn how to fight instead of assuming your opponent will be some unskilled moron.

 

[SandisLL]

Like a school fight?

These too might end with ER in 2 - 30 seconds.

 

[Icanseeu]

Just look up the gracie combatives program as that's what your looking for.

 

[StanClarker]

Gracie = crap!

You're letting marketing frame your whole reference.

You want to get off the ground, 99% of your training dedicated to the area you don't want to be is a waste of time.

Judo= control if you ever decide to let a situation go to the ground.

Ukemi will allow you go land on top and OseaKomi Waza to control the guy till bouncers/security shows up and the 15% Ne Waza to keep them put.

Ground=Sport.

Feet=Everything you'll ever need.

Not how serious this thread is. The advantage of BJJ over the Judo I'm learning is imo BJJ's technical depth.

My impression of BJJ is that it is quite a challenge to master the skills to an effective level, which seems echoed by certain thread comments.

I do think it's a great question for BJJ and Judo players to have in the back of their minds while working through the curriculum.

 

[Russky]

Not how serious this thread is. The advantage of BJJ over the Judo I'm learning is imo BJJ's technical depth.

My impression of BJJ is that it is quite a challenge to master the skills to an effective level, which seems echoed by certain thread comments.

Sounds like you never trained in Judo...

 

[StanClarker]

Sounds like you never trained in Judo...

Sounds like you trained in forum.

 

[liuk3]

BJJ for fun + 6-12 months of thai or boxing is more than enough, no need to LARP with Gracie junk.

Everything you do is likely LARPing. LOL