Social Can homeless people be fined for sleeping outside? A rural Oregon city asks the US Supreme Court

[avenue94]

Well where are they getting the 'drug use' stat from? Voluntary polling data? Lol

That's about the only way to get it. So unless there is a reason you think citizens of different states lie about drug use to different degrees...?

You can also tally drug overdoses, but they would tell the same story given that West Virginia leads and California isn't even in the top half.

 

[ColemanwastheGOAT]

That's about the only way to get it.

Then it's worthless.

 

[avenue94]

Then it's worthless.

Why would the population of one state lie about their drug use but another state wouldn't? (ie why are Californians underreporting drug use but West Virginians are overreporting it) And do drug overdose rates lie too?

I think you're just backpedaling because you don't know what an R2 value is... Wanna tell the class what that is?

 

[ColemanwastheGOAT]

Why would drug addicts lie about their drug addiction?

 

[avenue94]

@ColemanwastheGOAT
That's cute but you're being dishonest. The question isn't why people lie about drug use, it's why would they lie about it to different extents based on state. Those are two very different questions.

I'm still waiting for you to explain R2 to the class.

 

[ColemanwastheGOAT]

@ColemanwastheGOAT
That's cute but you're being dishonest. The question isn't why people lie about drug use, it's why would they lie about it to different extents based on state.

You're just working backwards from your own conclusion.

 

[Natural Order]

In the western world, we should be criminalizing politicians for even having homelessness. Not that it should be a free for all, but there's really no excuse for it in the west with all our resources. A war breaks out a million miles away, and the government is all of sudden tripping over billions and billions of dollars that they previously said they didn't have to help their own population, to help another people's population.

All this.

 

[avenue94]

You're just working backwards from your own conclusion.

Says the guy who has concluded that most homeless people are drug addicts based on personal anecdotes.

You've offered no systemic evidence for your position and would rather toss out actual statical evidence because it collides with your partisan worldview.

Again, why are California's underreprting drug abuse when the state has one of the most acute homeless epidemics. This seems odd given all I hear I'd that California has encouraged drug use and open air drug markets.

 

[ColemanwastheGOAT]

Says the guy who has concluded that most homeless people are drug addicts based on personal anecdotes.

You've offered no systemic evidence for your position and would rather toss out actual statical evidence because it collides with your partisan worldview.

Again, why are California's underreprting drug abuse when the state has one of the most acute homeless epidemics. This seems odd given all I hear I'd that California has encouraged drug use and open air drug markets.

I'm sure the very short term temporarily homeless people who get lumped into these stats do have lower drug use stats as they are actually victims of circumstance and typically are homeless for like a week or two as they simply use the services available to get themselves out of that situation.

Chronically homeless people are almost all drug addicts.

There's a lot of motivation to cook these stats specifically to get dopes like you on board with the failed liberal policies that have led to this epidemic in the first place.

 

[avenue94]

I'm sure the very short term temporarily homeless people who get lumped into these stats do have lower drug use stats as they are actually victims of circumstance and typically are homeless for like a week or two as they simply use the services available to get themselves out of that situation.

I thought you wanted to talk concrete evidence and all you've cited so far is your anecdotal experiences.

Chronically homeless people are almost all drug addicts.

Source?

There's a lot of motivation to cook these stats specifically to get dopes like you on board with the failed liberal policies that have led to this epidemic in the first place.

Dre Buetow, 48, from northern California, has been living in his car for three years after a bone cancer diagnosis and $450,000 in medical bills. The illness and treatment kept him from returning to his old tree-trimming job, he said.

Laura Gutowski’s husband died from a pulmonary embolism and she suddenly found herself, in her 50s, with no income. They didn’t have life insurance or savings and, within a month, she was sleeping outside in the city she grew up in.

Ah yes, who can remember when the liberals shot down any hopes of universal health care. Or that time the GOP tried to boost the elderly safety net and not cut it. Did you even read the opening post? Apparently not. Do tell me what failed liberal policies led to those two incidents.

My stance on homelessness has nothing to do with liberal vs conservative, I've been very blunt in my assessment of who's to blame for California's crisis (NIMBYs, who are both liberal and not)

 

[Sinister]

I'm sure the very short term temporarily homeless people who get lumped into these stats do have lower drug use stats as they are actually victims of circumstance and typically are homeless for like a week or two as they simply use the services available to get themselves out of that situation.

Chronically homeless people are almost all drug addicts.

There's a lot of motivation to cook these stats specifically to get dopes like you on board with the failed liberal policies that have led to this epidemic in the first place.

Lol@you accusing people of buying into a specific narrative when you've literally aggressively ignored actual empirical data on the subject that you have no refute for, because once upon a time you allegedly saw some homeless drug addicts. And that's not even getting into the correlation/causation argument.

 

[no fat chicks]

Ahh yes. Who better to fill out forms and pay a fine. What nice thing to have looming over you if you ever do decide to get your life back on track.

 

[ColemanwastheGOAT]

Lol@you accusing people of buying into a specific narrative when you've literally aggressively ignored actual empirical data on the subject that you have no refute for, because once upon a time you allegedly saw some homeless drug addicts. And that's not even getting into the correlation/causation argument.

Empirical data that relies on drug addicts to self report their drug addiction isn't empirical data.

 

[ferrisjso]

Saw this and thought of all yall lol.

 

[Sinister]

Oh hey don't look now, but anti-camping ordinances are already being used against regular citizens with a Police Captain even suggesting it to a guy because he saw on the internet that he was homeless 4 years prior lolz:

 

[fedoriswar37]

Heroin is extremely relevant to the topic of homelessness as it's the reason most of them are homeless.

Lmao. 1 , nobody does heroin anymore. 2. Thats not even close to true.

 

[DoctorNick]

Let he who has never passed out in a public place after a party throw the first stone.

-Kenny Florian

 

[DoctorTaco]

I see it as 3 key groups:

1. Have Nots
2. Can Nots
3. Will Nots

And each group needs different treatment:

Give enough subsidies to the Have Nots to keep them from falling off the bottom. Once they get some traction and forward momentum they won’t require further services.

Provide social service workers and treatment for the Can Nots. Help get them sober, on medication if needed, and healthy. From there they will move to one of the two other categories.

And the Will Nots. They can fuck right off. Either get them on a warrant of make their life miserable so they move on.

Republicans tend to think it’s all Will Nots. And the Democrats tend to act like it’s just Have Nots. We need to stop treating homeless people as a monolith.

 

[fedoriswar37]

Ahh yes. Who better to fill out forms and pay a fine. What nice thing to have looming over you if you ever do decide to get your life back on track.

Wrap around services are 1 of the most important things for people who are incarcerated. People who come out to no home , no support will likely reoffend.

 

[DoctorNick]

I see it as 3 key groups:

1. Have Nots
2. Can Nots
3. Will Nots

And each group needs different treatment:

Give enough subsidies to the Have Nots to keep them from falling off the bottom. Once they get some traction and forward momentum they won’t require further services.

Provide social service workers and treatment for the Can Nots. Help get them sober, on medication if needed, and healthy. From there they will move to one of the two other categories.

And the Will Nots. They can fuck right off. Either get them on a warrant of make their life miserable so they move on.

Republicans tend to think it’s all Will Nots. And the Democrats tend to act like it’s just Have Nots. We need to stop treating homeless people as a monolith.

Very well said. I've been lucky enough to see a few Can Nots totally turn it around when they received the help they needed.