Crime Donald Trump Hush Money Fraud Trial

[shinkyoku]

Has anyone pointed out to Trump and his cult that if the president has total immunity then why doesn't Biden just execute him?

Has anybody pointed that out to the supreme-curt? It would be one way to open up seats for friendly minded judges.
-Mr President, Why have you placed armed personnel in the courtroom?
-That depends on what I can do with immunity after you give your ruling Mr. Chief Justice.

 

[lilelvis]

hush money payments isn't a crime and the farty fraudster is not on trial for that. falsifying business documents in order to hide those payments it is a crime and that's why the mandarin molester is being brought to trial. falsifying business records in the first degree requires an intent to commit or conceal another crime and the primary crime in this case is statute 17-152.

So here is the text:
§ 17-152. Conspiracy to promote or prevent election. Any two or more persons who conspire to promote or prevent the election of any person to a public office by unlawful means and which conspiracy is acted upon by one or more of the parties thereto, shall be guilty of a misdemeanor.

An accountant calling retainer payments to a law firm “legal fees” is pretty normal. How that would become fraud, in this context, considering that hush money payments are not illegal and PR (shaping image or reputation) is a legit business expense, is what will be interesting to see.
I guess if someone hires a PR firm to help them in a political campaign in New York they are guilty of a misdemeanor, and if their attorney used retainer money to hire the firm it’s felony fraud.
I’m decent at business, but certainly no attorney.
I wait with bated breath…..

 

[idrankyourbeer]

So here is the text:
§ 17-152. Conspiracy to promote or prevent election. Any two or more persons who conspire to promote or prevent the election of any person to a public office by unlawful means and which conspiracy is acted upon by one or more of the parties thereto, shall be guilty of a misdemeanor.

An accountant calling retainer payments to a law firm “legal fees” is pretty normal.

how about an accountant calling hush money payments to a whore "legal fees"?

thats where your argument ends and thats why the mandarin molester is on trial.

accountants know better than that though. i'm pretty sure most of them know better than to falsify their own tax returns, or cheat on their pregnant wives with whores from the gangbang videos either. most, not all anyways.

 

[andnowweknow]

So here is the text:
§ 17-152. Conspiracy to promote or prevent election. Any two or more persons who conspire to promote or prevent the election of any person to a public office by unlawful means and which conspiracy is acted upon by one or more of the parties thereto, shall be guilty of a misdemeanor.

An accountant calling retainer payments to a law firm “legal fees” is pretty normal. How that would become fraud, in this context, considering that hush money payments are not illegal and PR (shaping image or reputation) is a legit business expense, is what will be interesting to see.
I guess if someone hires a PR firm to help them in a political campaign in New York they are guilty of a misdemeanor, and if their attorney used retainer money to hire the firm it’s felony fraud.
I’m decent at business, but certainly no attorney.
I wait with bated breath…..

Listen to Giuliani here offering legal opinions...

If you typed that while in front of a landscaping business bookended by a crematorium and a dildo shop, hespect!

 

[lilelvis]

how about an accountant calling hush money payments to a whore "legal fees"?

thats where your argument ends and thats why the mandarin molester is on trial.

accountants know better than that though. i'm pretty sure most of them know better than to falsify their own tax returns, or cheat on their pregnant wives with whores from the gangbang videos either. most, not all anyways.

I explained my thoughts in pretty clear English.
I’m referring to the case, not judging character.

 

[lilelvis]

Listen to Giuliani here offering legal opinions...

If you typed that while in front of a landscaping business bookended by a crematorium and a dildo shop, hespect!

I was shopping for a buttplug. Mmmmm, maybe I’ll try the landscaping yard.
Thanks for that. Innovation is a thing.

 

[idrankyourbeer]

I was shopping for a buttplug. Mmmmm, maybe I’ll try the landscaping yard.
Thanks for that. Innovation is a thing.

you can get your buttplug and your copy of granny gangbang episode #45 - bowlin' in her colon, go to church, cremate your dead grandmother, get a cash advance, buy a bunch of shit for your garden, get your car repaired, detailed, and gassed up, resolve your legal disputes, and overturn a presidential election all within the confines of one small city block. what a time to be alive!

 

[Turf Skirmish]

you can get your buttplug and your copy of granny gangbang episode #45 - bowlin' in her colon, go to church, cremate your dead grandmother, get a cash advance, buy a bunch of shit for your garden, get your car repaired, detailed, and gassed up, resolve your legal disputes, and overturn a presidential election all within the confines of one small city block. what a time to be alive!

15 minute city!

 

[idrankyourbeer]

15 minute city!

going to church and then loading up your basket full of dildos, buttplugs, and porno tapes while you detail your car, cremate grandma, and overturn a presidential election is probably not the kind of 15 minute cities that they first envisioned.

what happens on that street block stays on that street block.

 

[sickc0d3r]

So here is the text:
§ 17-152. Conspiracy to promote or prevent election. Any two or more persons who conspire to promote or prevent the election of any person to a public office by unlawful means and which conspiracy is acted upon by one or more of the parties thereto, shall be guilty of a misdemeanor.

An accountant calling retainer payments to a law firm “legal fees” is pretty normal. How that would become fraud, in this context, considering that hush money payments are not illegal and PR (shaping image or reputation) is a legit business expense, is what will be interesting to see.
I guess if someone hires a PR firm to help them in a political campaign in New York they are guilty of a misdemeanor, and if their attorney used retainer money to hire the firm it’s felony fraud.
I’m decent at business, but certainly no attorney.
I wait with bated breath…..

I think the crimes Cohen committed were crimes (unlawful and excessive campaign contribution, false statements to a bank, tax fraud).
And the falsified record of the check to Cohen to reimburse him for committing those crimes that they all conspired to commit was a crime. That’s what the prosecution is trying to prove, sounds like.

I am also not a lawyer, though. I’m enjoying the show either way.

 

[lilelvis]

I think the crimes Cohen committed were crimes (unlawful and excessive campaign contribution, false statements to a bank, tax fraud).
And the falsified record of the check to Cohen to reimburse him for committing those crimes that they all conspired to commit was a crime. That’s what the prosecution is trying to prove, sounds like.

I am also not a lawyer, though. I’m enjoying the show either way.

I don’t really know the details of the Cohen case, or the Trump case for that matter. That’s why I asked about the broken law being alleged.
I’ve looked at right and left leaning news on it and all of it lacks detail.
I appreciated your perspective and a measured discussion.
I was listening to the supremes argue the immunity question and everyone seemed reasonable to me. I’ve only heard part of Trumps attorneys argument. I’ll get to the rest as time allows.
We’ll see how this shakes out.

 

[sickc0d3r]

I don’t really know the details of the Cohen case, or the Trump case for that matter. That’s why I asked about the broken law being alleged.
I’ve looked at right and left leaning news on it and all of it lacks detail.
I appreciated your perspective and a measured discussion.
I was listening to the supremes argue the immunity question and everyone seemed reasonable to me. I’ve only heard part of Trumps attorneys argument. I’ll get to the rest as time allows.
We’ll see how this shakes out.

Cohen pleaded guilty to those crimes that I mentioned. The NYDA has to prove that Trump falsified records in order to conceal what Cohen did.

The defense is going to argue that it’s bookkeeping stuff, Trump had no knowledge (he was president when he signed the checks), and the payoff was to protect his family and brand, anyway. They want to bring up the feds dropping the case—we’ll see if the judge lets them—but then he’s not being charged with violating election laws, which is all the feds were looking for. And Cohen did, in fact, break those laws.

The prosecution has recordings of him discussing the payoff to Stormy and the McDougal story, plus witnesses like Pecker saying they were burying stories for the campaign. They’ll be allowed to show the jury all his other recorded instances of lying and fraud (there’s lots to choose from), and they have Cohen’s conviction for his role in this. Cohen’s credibility is probably the biggest question mark.

I think he’s almost certainly guilty in reality—we’ll see after all the evidence comes out—but it’s 50/50 based on the jury believing Cohen. I also think it’s not really a big deal as crimes go. I don’t think any of us believe all that money being thrown around during elections by every major politician and their donors is always on the up and up. Thanks, scotus, for that fucking CU decision.

 

[idrankyourbeer]

Cohen pleaded guilty to those crimes that I mentioned. The NYDA has to prove that Trump falsified records in order to conceal what Cohen did.

The defense is going to argue that it’s bookkeeping stuff, Trump had no knowledge (he was president when he signed the checks), and the payoff was to protect his family and brand, anyway. They want to bring up the feds dropping the case—we’ll see if the judge lets them—but then he’s not being charged with violating election laws, which is all the feds were looking for. And Cohen did, in fact, break those laws.

The prosecution has recordings of him discussing the payoff to Stormy and the McDougal story, plus witnesses like Pecker saying they were burying stories for the campaign. They’ll be allowed to show the jury all his other recorded instances of lying and fraud (there’s lots to choose from), and they have Cohen’s conviction for his role in this. Cohen’s credibility is probably the biggest question mark.

I think he’s almost certainly guilty in reality—we’ll see after all the evidence comes out—but it’s 50/50 based on the jury believing Cohen. I also think it’s not really a big deal as crimes go. I don’t think any of us believe all that money being thrown around during elections by every major politician and their donors is always on the up and up. Thanks, scotus, for that fucking CU decision.

even though they've got it all lined up, this is actually their weakest case out of the 4, and as a first time non-violent offender, the fraudy orange rapist likely won't see any prison time if convicted.

it's a shame that it had to be this trial out of the 4 that kicks off before the election. if it was any of the others he'd be landing in prison before november. by the time he gets pink socked in the election again he is going to be completely desperate and absolutely terrified because he'll know he's up the river. shame that his cute little fraudulent elector scam isn't going to work with democrats in the whitehouse and will only lead to more felony charges. but you can expect him to bombard the courts with hundreds more frivolous election litigation lawsuits from the finest team of parking garage lawyers, swingset installers, personal injury lawyers, divorce attorneys, qanon conspiratards, washed up village drunkards who used to be a mayor, and of course, the OANN Bimbo Squad, all of whom he will refuse to pay.

 

[sickc0d3r]

even though they've got it all lined up, this is actually their weakest case out of the 4, and as a first time non-violent offender, the fraudy orange rapist likely won't see any prison time if convicted.

it's a shame that it had to be this trial out of the 4 that kicks off before the election. if it was any of the others he'd be landing in prison before november. by the time he gets pink socked in the election again he is going to be completely desperate and absolutely terrified because he'll know he's up the river. shame that his cute little fraudulent elector scam isn't going to work with democrats in the whitehouse and will only lead to more felony charges. but you can expect him to bombard the courts with hundreds more frivolous election litigation lawsuits from the finest team of parking garage lawyers, swingset installers, personal injury lawyers, divorce attorneys, qanon conspiratards, washed up village drunkards who used to be a mayor, and of course, the OANN Bimbo Squad, all of whom he will refuse to pay.

I agree, the other 3 cases are slam dunks. His ONLY chance in any of them is a maga fanatic jury member. This one will depend more on the prosecution’s skill, I think. And if Trump isn’t convicted, all it does is help him in the election.

A conviction would be a major blow to his campaign, though, even without jail time. And, laaawd, if he loses the election, he’s about to get dry fucked in those other cases. I expect major chaos and some new indictments if he loses to dank Brandon again.

 

[lilelvis]

Cohen pleaded guilty to those crimes that I mentioned. The NYDA has to prove that Trump falsified records in order to conceal what Cohen did.

The defense is going to argue that it’s bookkeeping stuff, Trump had no knowledge (he was president when he signed the checks), and the payoff was to protect his family and brand, anyway. They want to bring up the feds dropping the case—we’ll see if the judge lets them—but then he’s not being charged with violating election laws, which is all the feds were looking for. And Cohen did, in fact, break those laws.

The prosecution has recordings of him discussing the payoff to Stormy and the McDougal story, plus witnesses like Pecker saying they were burying stories for the campaign. They’ll be allowed to show the jury all his other recorded instances of lying and fraud (there’s lots to choose from), and they have Cohen’s conviction for his role in this. Cohen’s credibility is probably the biggest question mark.

I think he’s almost certainly guilty in reality—we’ll see after all the evidence comes out—but it’s 50/50 based on the jury believing Cohen. I also think it’s not really a big deal as crimes go. I don’t think any of us believe all that money being thrown around during elections by every major politician and their donors is always on the up and up. Thanks, scotus, for that fucking CU decision.

100% agree.
No doubt this was done. It’s the crime part that’s sketchy. Normally the feds fine campaigns for misappropriating funds, but chose not to here. Not sure why.

I have no problem with campaign finance reform, it’s a huge money laundering issue with candidates enriching friends and family (ultimately themselves) through shell advertising companies, PR firms, consulting firms, etc.. everyone wonder why Haley stayed in so long? Not me…
If we’re going to clean it up, great. But bludgeon them all.
This whole thing reeks of politics. I felt the same about Bill Clinton and John Edwards when that shit went down, although I’m pretty sure there were some sketchy dealings going on. Let’s not act like this isn’t something that’s been going on since 1800 and just gets waved off.

Cheers, sick.. have a great Sunday..

 

[idrankyourbeer]

I agree, the other 3 cases are slam dunks. His ONLY chance in any of them is a maga fanatic jury member. This one will depend more on the prosecution’s skill, I think. And if Trump isn’t convicted, all it does is help him in the election.

A conviction would be a major blow to his campaign, though, even without jail time. And, laaawd, if he loses the election, he’s about to get dry fucked in those other cases. I expect major chaos and some new indictments if he loses to dank Brandon again.

his supporters aint gonna care if he gets convicted. they'll give the rapey fartster their votes even if he rapes their wives right there on 5'th avenue with them watching.

weird though how he keeps trying to rally up his finest blowhards in NYC and send them over to the courthouse and so far basically nobody is showing up and he's pissed about it. i guess they must be terrified of having any kind of protests and gatherings ever since their failed insurrection at the capitol when droves of them got hauled off to jail and put on trial for their crimes.

i'll bet many of them won't even show up because they'll think that trump's cries for protests is some kind of super secret deep state psy-op where the FBI is setting them all up, where if they go down to the courthouse and raise a bunch of hell and break the law and beat up some cops and storm their way into the courthouse, they'll end up getting arrested and going to prison. it's like doing a math equation where they did all of the work to solve the equation completely wrong but they still managed to come up with the right answer in the end.

 

[sickc0d3r]

his supporters aint gonna care if he gets convicted. they'll give the rapey fartster their vote even if he rapes their wife right there on 5'th avenue with them watching.

Independents will care, though. And I reckon this election is about like 3 states, and like 80k votes. I think Joe holds PA and Trump flips GA. That means Joe has to either hold MI, or hold both NV and AZ. All 3 will be very close and probably come down to those fence sitters.

 

[andnowweknow]

Independents will care, though. And I reckon this election is about like 3 states, and like 80k votes. I think Joe holds PA and Trump flips GA. That means Joe has to either hold MI, or hold both NV and AZ. All 3 will be very close and probably come down to those fence sitters.

People keep making the assumption that this election will be something different than a referendum on Trump. It won't be. Just like the last election, it will be how many yay votes Trump gets vs. nay votes. The other guy is an afterthought.

Nobody who voted Biden is going to switch to Trump, and Trump will be shown in November to have lost huge support among independents.

Trump us going to be in the news for FELONIES he's committed and trials ongoing through election day. Trump is going to lose by far greater margins than in 2020...he hasn't gained support, he's lost it.

 

[sickc0d3r]

People keep making the assumption that this election will be something different than a referendum on Trump. It won't be. Just like the last election, it will be how many yay votes Trump gets vs. nay votes. The other guy is an afterthought.

Nobody who voted Biden is going to switch to Trump, and Trump will be shown in November to have lost huge support among independents.

Trump us going to be in the news for FELONIES he's committed and trials ongoing through election day. Trump is going to lose by far greater margins than in 2020...he hasn't gained support, he's lost it.

Polling doesn’t tell that story (at least not yet), but I hope you’re right. I’m taking the cynical view until my fellow Americans prove they’re not morons.

 

[andnowweknow]

Polling doesn’t tell that story (at least not yet), but I hope you’re right. I’m taking the cynical view until my fellow Americans prove they’re not morons.

I hear ya...but Trump is literally going to be campaigning from courtrooms where he's being charged with, again, felonies. Polls at this point in time in the election season are next to meaningless, regardless of who is being shown in a good light. These trials are a stark reminder to moderate and independent voters that the shit show of felony trials and porn stars will not stop if Trump is elected, the shit show will return and it will be a complete clown show with inept, unqualified idiot sycophants of Trump manning the government.

Unless their is a SIGNIFICANT dip in voter turnout from 2020, Trump is going to lose by such a farcical large number that his followers will have a new angle for saying "its all just so unfair!"