Social HK Edgerton argues confederate flag is 'Heritage Not Hate'.

[KnightTemplar]

States rights is the southern sanitization of the civil war, starting with Jim Crowe they taught their children that the south fought to preserve their way of life, not slavery. It's bullshit, if you take a look at the articles of secession you'll see what the south was fighting for.

Candace Owens likes to say that hundreds of thousands of Americans died to free the slaves, but that's also a lie. Southerners died to keep slavery, northerners died to preserve the union. Emancipation came long after the war started and only after black men joined the union army.

Thanks for the clarification on State's Rights.

Regarding the motivations for the Civil War, didn't Lincoln himself say words to the effect that he would either free the slaves or keep them enslaved, whichever would preserve the Union?

Thanks for the clarification on State's Rights.

Regarding the motivations for the Civil War, didn't Lincoln himself say words to the effect that he would either free the slaves or keep them enslaved, whichever would preserve the Union?

Yes.

It's hard to say what was in his heart, but he did say he had no intention of emancipating. He's also said he didn't think black and white people could live together as equals and started a plan to move black people out of America.

I don't go to Youtube for anything remotely related to news. Anything based around an algorithm is in my "who fucking knows what's true" category.

Most reputable youtubers have the decency to link their sources in the descriptions of their videos.

I mean, enough to fuck with the Korean lady talking shit about you at a manicure place

That is pretty funny when it happens.

So...nowhere? Good times.

He was responding to you in acknowledgement that we're in an information environment where actual National leaders said "alternative facts" with a straight face. Right now many people consider "truth" to be what confirms their biases. That's why he said facts, not "the truth."

 

[Sinister]

Thanks for the clarification on State's Rights.

Regarding the motivations for the Civil War, didn't Lincoln himself say words to the effect that he would either free the slaves or keep them enslaved, whichever would preserve the Union?

Yes.

It's hard to say what was in his heart, but he did say he had no intention of emancipating. He's also said he didn't think black and white people could live together as equals and started a plan to move black people out of America.

Lincoln famously made this statement as a response to heat he was getting in Presidential debates where his opponent was openly referring to him as a "n*gger lover." Interestingly Lincoln's whole political career marked one of the first major political shifts in the US, where the Whig party was irreparably split, and a newer Republican party was formed. That new Republican party had a distinctly anti-slavery platform. Lincoln did absolutely hate slavery (as his Father did before him, taught him slavery was a absolutely immoral), but he also knew that invoking change could end the US. This was the full quote:

"As to the policy I “seem to be pursuing” as you say, I have not meant to leave any one in doubt. I would save the Union. I would save it the shortest way under the Constitution. The sooner the national authority can be restored; the nearer the Union will be “the Union as it was.” If there be those who would not save the Union, unless they could at the same time save slavery, I do not agree with them. If there be those who would not save the Union unless they could at the same time destroy slavery, I do not agree with them. My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is not either to save or to destroy slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that."

This shows just how great of a politician Lincoln really was, as he had already made his decision with the idea of the Emancipation Proclamation, which was the "some, not all" approach, but he knew even that first step would set the changes in-motion. Lincoln was not friendly of violent abolitionists, but this makes sense. It's tough to Govern effectively if you espouse extremism (as we're seeing now), even if most people would feel that extremism justifiable. Lincoln was skeptical of integration because he was witnessing the fire of people who felt they had a God-given right to own other human beings, not because he himself had little regard for black people. He felt the US may never be safe for them. His letters in his later years before assassination were much more receptive towards the idea that black people needed to not only be full citizens, but must have equal rights under the laws as white people, including equal pay, Military pensions, etc.

 

[Loiosh]

Lincoln famously made this statement as a response to heat he was getting in Presidential debates where his opponent was openly referring to him as a "n*gger lover." Interestingly Lincoln's whole political career marked one of the first major political shifts in the US, where the Whig party was irreparably split, and a newer Republican party was formed. That new Republican party had a distinctly anti-slavery platform. Lincoln did absolutely hate slavery (as his Father did before him, taught him slavery was a absolutely immoral), but he also knew that invoking change could end the US. This was the full quote:

"As to the policy I “seem to be pursuing” as you say, I have not meant to leave any one in doubt. I would save the Union. I would save it the shortest way under the Constitution. The sooner the national authority can be restored; the nearer the Union will be “the Union as it was.” If there be those who would not save the Union, unless they could at the same time save slavery, I do not agree with them. If there be those who would not save the Union unless they could at the same time destroy slavery, I do not agree with them. My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is not either to save or to destroy slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that."

This shows just how great of a political Lincoln really was, as he had already made his decision with the idea of the Emancipation Proclamation, which was the "some, not all" approach, but he knew even that first step would set the changes in-motion. Lincoln was not friendly of violebt abolitionists, but this makes sense. It's tough to Goverb effectively if you espouse extremism, even if most people would feel that extremism justifiable. Lincoln was skeptical of integration because he was witnessing the fire of people who felt they had a God-given right to own other human beings, not because he himself had little regard for black people. He felt the US may never be safe for them. His letters in his later years before assassination were much more receptive towards the idea that black people needed to not only be full citizens, but must have equal rights under the laws as white people, including equal pay, Military pensions, etc.

I swear I knew you would have more detailed comments on this. I even avoided putting too much work into my post because I knew you'd flesh it out.

In related news I watched the (Ulysses S.) Grant miniseries yesterday and it was good. Reconstruction sucked.

 

[Sinister]

I swear I knew you would have more detailed comments on this. I even avoided putting too much work into my post because I knew you'd flesh it out.

In related news I watched the (Ulysses S.) Grant miniseries yesterday and it was good. Reconstruction sucked.

Lol, thanks for the vote of confidence.

I first investigated Lincoln after reading James Loewen's work (who I HIGHLY recommend for anyone who wants to know how US History should be taught), because I never subscribed to the myth having grown up in a very racially charged part of the Country. The more I learned the more I realized he was probably our greatest President over all, with all things considered, especially what was going on at the time.

I neglected to mention what I meant by a dramatic shift in US politics. When the new Republican party formed essentially EVERY anti-slavery politician joined it, this included a large number of anti-slavery Democrats. Maybe we should call this the "Northern Switch." The opposite of what happened in the South much later.

It's also safe to say that there may have never been an end to slavery without foreign influence, most notably France. Lincoln was facing what would have been catastrophic trade sanctions if he allowed the institution of slavery to continue. Despite that Civil War was imminent, how he handled both foreign and domestic challenges was nothing short of astounding.

 

[Iconoclast]

If you are confounded then you should ask questions or challenge what I'm not saying instead of randomly declaringv that I hate myself lol. Thats just silly.

You're words say it. I just can't understand that kind of logic homey. Do you though.

 

[KnightTemplar]

Lincoln famously made this statement as a response to heat he was getting in Presidential debates where his opponent was openly referring to him as a "n*gger lover." Interestingly Lincoln's whole political career marked one of the first major political shifts in the US, where the Whig party was irreparably split, and a newer Republican party was formed. That new Republican party had a distinctly anti-slavery platform. Lincoln did absolutely hate slavery (as his Father did before him, taught him slavery was a absolutely immoral), but he also knew that invoking change could end the US. This was the full quote:

"As to the policy I “seem to be pursuing” as you say, I have not meant to leave any one in doubt. I would save the Union. I would save it the shortest way under the Constitution. The sooner the national authority can be restored; the nearer the Union will be “the Union as it was.” If there be those who would not save the Union, unless they could at the same time save slavery, I do not agree with them. If there be those who would not save the Union unless they could at the same time destroy slavery, I do not agree with them. My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is not either to save or to destroy slavery. If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that."

This shows just how great of a politician Lincoln really was, as he had already made his decision with the idea of the Emancipation Proclamation, which was the "some, not all" approach, but he knew even that first step would set the changes in-motion. Lincoln was not friendly of violent abolitionists, but this makes sense. It's tough to Govern effectively if you espouse extremism (as we're seeing now), even if most people would feel that extremism justifiable. Lincoln was skeptical of integration because he was witnessing the fire of people who felt they had a God-given right to own other human beings, not because he himself had little regard for black people. He felt the US may never be safe for them. His letters in his later years before assassination were much more receptive towards the idea that black people needed to not only be full citizens, but must have equal rights under the laws as white people, including equal pay, Military pensions, etc.

Excellent post. Thank you for the history lesson, and providing context to the Lincoln quote I incorrectly recalled.

 

[Mack Yancy]

You're the one who brought up Trump, not me.

You brought up your ridiculous Trump t-shirts at the gym first, the topic was about Jason Aldean and Richmond guy, no one even mentioned Trump, you went out of your way to mention your brand-loyal clothing. You're getting forgetful in your old age.

This is one of the many reasons I find you so entertaining.

 

[gspieler]

States rights is the southern sanitization of the civil war, starting with Jim Crowe they taught their children that the south fought to preserve their way of life, not slavery. It's bullshit, if you take a look at the articles of secession you'll see what the south was fighting for.

Candace Owens likes to say that hundreds of thousands of Americans died to free the slaves, but that's also a lie. Southerners died to keep slavery, northerners died to preserve the union. Emancipation came long after the war started and only after black men joined the union army.

It would've been obvious in '63, to all parties concerned, that a Union victory ended the "peculiar institution". And given the fact many/most of the bloodiest battles happened in the second half of the war, and having anti-slavery sentiments was the norm in the Union army, I think it's fair to say that, in addition for the purpose of preservation of the Union, those soldiers died for the destruction of slavery.

 

[KnightTemplar]

You brought up your ridiculous Trump t-shirts at the gym first, the topic was about Jason Aldean and Richmond guy, no one even mentioned Trump, you went out of your way to mention your brand-loyal clothing. You're getting forgetful in your old age.

This is one of the many reasons I find you so entertaining.

That wasn't even in this thread, mongoloid. The fact you feel the need to dig around in past threads as some kind of pathetic attempt at a, "Gotcha!" only proves how emotionally weak you are.

The feeling is mutual. I find your retardation and cowardice endlessly entertaining

 

[DougieJones]

Just my opinion, but no American should be flying the flag that signifies trying to break up our country

I would have zero problem if it were banned outright

 

[Mack Yancy]

That wasn't even in this thread, mongoloid. The fact you feel the need to dig around in past threads as some kind of pathetic attempt at a, "Gotcha!" only proves how emotionally weak you are.

The feeling is mutual. I find your retardation and cowardice endlessly entertaining

I can see why you want to quickly move on from your previous embarrassment but sorry, memory loss only effects you, Hoss.

And you can't talk about emotional weakness, I can summon you whenever I want to entertain myself and you can do nothing but respond lest your feelings and pride get hurt.



So how many liberal 'women' have you scored with from the uni, lets hear the stories.

 

[Ezekiel 25:17]

Is this the real Clayton Bigsby!?

 

[Mack Yancy]

Is this the real Clayton Bigsby!?

No, that's @PhitePhan

 

[KnightTemplar]

I can see why you want to quickly move on from your previous embarrassment but sorry, memory loss only effects you, Hoss.

And you can't talk about emotional weakness, I can summon you whenever I want to entertain myself and you can do nothing but respond lest your feelings and pride get hurt.



So how many liberal 'women' have you scored with from the uni, lets hear the stories.

Yeah, you're a typical Libtard; too weak and stupid to win the fight, too cowardly to admit defeat.

And don't worry, son. I'm sure if you White Knight enough sluts, one of them will eventually touch you in your Little Special Place.

Just like your Momma used to

 

[Mack Yancy]

Yeah, you're a typical Libtard; too weak and stupid to win the fight, too cowardly to admit defeat.

And don't worry, son. I'm sure if you White Knight enough sluts, one of them will eventually touch you in your Little Special Place.

Just like your Momma used to

You mean like how libtard Joe Biden beat your sore loser Daddy Pump Trump in 2020?

Has wearing those t-shirts gotten you laid by university student left wing dick chicks yet? You said it with such pride.

And Scottish people don't say Momma, stay in your lane, Angus.

 

[Sinister]

Yeah, you're a typical Libtard; too weak and stupid to win the fight, too cowardly to admit defeat.

And don't worry, son. I'm sure if you White Knight enough sluts, one of them will eventually touch you in your Little Special Place.

Just like your Momma used to

You mean like how libtard Joe Biden beat your sore loser Daddy Pump Trump in 2020?

Has wearing those t-shirts gotten you laid by university student left wing dick chicks yet? You said it with such pride.

And Scottish people don't say Momma, stay in your lane, Angus.

Mack is right. Next time say "yer Mammy" and I'll die laughing from reading it in a heavy Scottish accent.

 

[KnightTemplar]

Mack is right. Next time say "yer Mammy" and I'll die laughing from reading it in a heavy Scottish accent.

Yancy barely speaks English; I had to correct his spelling of, "America". I didn't want to confuse him by lapsing into dialect

 

[Mack Yancy]

Yancy barely speaks English; I had to correct his spelling of, "America". I didn't want to confuse him by lapsing into dialect

Yep I made a typo, you got me there, Groundskeeper Willie.

Now tell me more about how libtard Joe Biden lost 2020, because as you say libtards always lose.

@BearGrounds @PhitePhan also think Joe Biden lost, so you giving us your explanation might finally crack this case!

 

[BearGrounds]

Yep I made a typo, you got me there, Groundskeeper Willie.

Now tell me more about how libtard Joe Biden lost 2020, because as you say libtards always lose.

@BearGrounds @PhitePhan also think Joe Biden lost, so you giving us your explanation might finally crack this case!

I live in your head, rent free. Lovely stuff.

 

[Roaming East]

brought Uncle Ruckus out again eh? no surprise.