Is a college degree worth anything?

[TheRuthlessOne]

If you have no social skills and no network, a college degree may be your only worth.

Well I read some books about college

Getting your network set up is one of the big things to do. A lot of people don't have a network until they get to college

 

[SmilinDesperado]

Adam Carolla always talks about how the most important thing is to "learn how to work". He never went to college and his parents had degrees in art or someshit, and he's done really well for himself (wealthy, beautiful family, enjoys his hobbies)

I used to listen to Corolla pretty religiously back in the day, but the guy is a dunce on this topic.
He is a lot more lucky than he wants to admit. He is funny, and smart, but almost nobody could have done what he did and made it like he did.
He didn't even make it big till he was like 30+. He could have easily still been working construction had he not met Jimmy Kimmel.
"Learn how to work" is important, and CAN set you up for better opportunities, but simply working hard doesn't guarantee you anything.
Plenty of people work hard and are still poor as shit

 

[Possum Jenkins]

If you have to teach basic things like that then the society is fucked.

Of course you have to teach that. No one is born knowing them.

And what you learn in K-12 isn't enough because you're still having your hand held. There's so much more independence in college that it forces you to be responsible, forces you to delay gratification.

Kind of extrapolating here but I really think this is a big reason why so many of the people working high-salary, low-education jobs (working in oil rigs or in construction, for example) are horrible managing their money.

Very few of them invest or spend wisely. Most blow their money on drinking, partying, fixing up their cars and trucks, etc. Far less college graduates do the same.

 

[POWER2]

In light of the recent scandals and what many of us knew previously about people buying degrees, does a college degree have any real value?

Does it make sense to spend a lot of money, put yourself in debt to get a piece of paper or sheepskin and an education that you will never use?

Even worse, that education might hurt instead of helping. I've seen many businesses that were started and built up by generations of people who didn't go to college but were run into the ground in a short time by a generation that did go to college.

That degree might help you get a job. Some companies only hire people with a degree for management positions. Many don't care what kind of degree a person has. I know a facility manager who had a degree as an English teacher. It ended badly.

I read a lot of obituaries and have noticed that many people went to college and got a degree in something that they never used or used for a short time before taking a job unrelated to their field of study.

Even many of the things we are taught in high school are never used by a lot of people.

yes.

it's not about what you learn (even though it should be) it's about convincing people that you can learn and act quickly, in the interest of your job, career and employer.

 

[MadSquabbles500]

The only worth is the status symbol the degree bestows upon recipient. That is what it always was.

If you have knowledge or skill, you dont need a plaque to indicate. Just prove it, challenge people to let you prove it.

And it matters how many people have. The more people with same status symbol dilutes the worth of your status.

 

[Madmick]

The only worth is the status symbol the degree bestows upon recipient. That is what it always was.

If you have knowledge or skill, you dont need a plaque to indicate. Just prove it, challenge people to let you prove it.

And it matters how many people have. The more people with same status symbol dilutes the worth of your status.

Objectively wrong. Ignorant.

 

[MadSquabbles500]

Objectively wrong. Ignorant.

Oh yeh, Then what is your take?

 

[Madmick]

These threads about college always bring out the inferiority complexes. To any inquisitive youths reading this thread: be very careful to consider the probable backgrounds of your audience.

It certainly has value, around 20,000 worth of value .. and you will have to pay it.

$20k in the first year you're out is pretty close to accurate.

https://www.payscale.com/college-salary-report/bachelors

Mid-career average salary across all Stanford grads is only ~350% the national average.

Think for yourselves, kids. Use your own calculators.

 

[rj144]

It's difficult to get a job in engineering or science without one.

 

[BillytheFish]

If you have knowledge or skill, you dont need a plaque to indicate. Just prove it, challenge people to let you prove it.

And it matters how many people have. The more people with same status symbol dilutes the worth of your status.

Lol is that right?

"let me do surgery on that critical patient, I know i can't prove it by any recorded learning and peer-reviewed skills but I promise I can do it!"

The 'status symbol' as you call it, opens doors to jobs, shows the world you have proven capable of performing a task to a specific set of standards.

A Green Beret is a symbol, a Medical Diploma is a symbol...do we need to explain how currency works to you also?

 

[panamaican]

Funny you say that. I work for a huge multinational company. We make titanium. The number one engineer at our plant has no degree. Given hes worked here for 50 years... the guy knows everything, all the engineers with degrees consult him.

I know that's no longer common at all, but I think it's pretty cool, the guy is down to earth but probably knocking down high 6 figures yearly.

Yeah, it's funny how the world's changed.

My grandfather went from shoeing horses to being an engineer on the Panama Canal and even got a commendation for an engineering innovation there. No college degree, probably no more than an 8th grade education in a 3rd world country.

These days that's just impossible. They'd never let you near anything without an engineering degree and probably expect a PhD before they let you come up with something.

 

[MadSquabbles500]

These threads about college always bring out the inferiority complexes. To any inquisitive youths reading this thread: be very careful to consider the probable backgrounds of your audience.

$20k in the first year you're out is pretty close to accurate.

https://www.payscale.com/college-salary-report/bachelors

Mid-career average salary across all Stanford grads is only ~350% the national average.

Think for yourselves, kids. Use your own calculators.

So having a degree from certain schools is not giving you the status you need to obtain high paying entry level, which is the stepping stone to another higher paying job?

With status comes perks too.

 

[MetalGearTrump]

Yeah, it's funny how the world's changed.

My grandfather went from shoeing horses to being an engineer on the Panama Canal and even got a commendation for an engineering innovation there. No college degree, probably no more than an 8th grade education in a 3rd world country.

These days that's just impossible. They'd never let you near anything without an engineering degree and probably expect a PhD before they let you come up with something.

To an extent it kind of highlights how you dont HAVE to have a degree to learn these things. Not that theres ever gonna be learn on the job engineering without a degree.

I think itd be a great idea to cut out the fluff in these fields. It seems unreasonable to require someone who wants to get a chemical engineering degree to take a class unrelated or not vital to said degree

 

[panamaican]

To an extent it kind of highlights how you dont HAVE to have a degree to learn these things. Not that theres ever gonna be learn on the job engineering without a degree.

I think itd be a great idea to cut out the fluff in these fields. It seems unreasonable to require someone who wants to get a chemical engineering degree to take a class unrelated or not vital to said degree

I disagree there. A good college education is more than just job training. You should come out of college a well-rounded person. It should broaden your understanding of the world, not narrow it to a single field of study.

Also, there's the theory that the reason you can't do these things that way anymore is because they're more complex than they were 100 years ago. I always think about cars and mechanics. 80 years ago, anyone could change their oil and probably work on their engine in the driveway. These days, it's nearly impossible with a lot of specialized knowledge and tools.

This guy alludes to it in a piece about how the claims about grade inflation aren't true.
https://patrickjuli.us/2018/03/04/is-grade-inflation-a-real-problem/

 

[MadSquabbles500]

Lol is that right?

"let me do surgery on that critical patient, I know i can't prove it by any recorded learning and peer-reviewed skills but I promise I can do it!"

The 'status symbol' as you call it, opens doors to jobs, shows the world you have proven capable of performing a task to a specific set of standards.

A Green Beret is a symbol, a Medical Diploma is a symbol...do we need to explain how currency works to you also?

Even after your graduate medical school, you have to do residency, which is a trial period for you to prove yourself.

 

[BillytheFish]

Even after your graduate medical school, you have to do residency, which is a trial period for you to prove yourself.

If you graduate med school then do not do a residency then you are not allowed to treat a patient in hospital. You have to apply for a residency and this relies on proving yourself through achievements both extra curricular and academic. You dont get to go on a residency without the MD 'symbol'.

Not sure of your point here, are you saying healthcare should be 'on the job' without prior training? Even if I was to humor that...how do you choose who gets access to 'on the job training'...because the current system (that chooses people via status symbols of A grades and medical diplomas seems to work just fine).

 

[BillytheFish]

To an extent it kind of highlights how you dont HAVE to have a degree to learn these things. Not that theres ever gonna be learn on the job engineering without a degree.

I think itd be a great idea to cut out the fluff in these fields. It seems unreasonable to require someone who wants to get a chemical engineering degree to take a class unrelated or not vital to said degree

some colleges do respect non-academic learning in the for of APL (accredited prior learning). Some also allow you to 'test out' of subjects, if you know the material required to pass the class one should know how to answer questions in the exam...as opposed to taking a 3 month course.

I agree with ditching the fluff, but so does alot of America and it is a hotly debated topic. They claim to want well-rounded students. In the medical world they are pushing courses like arts and ethics because they claim it fosters students abilty to empathize with patients and be more 'human'. As in not having some robotic doctor tell a patient theyre dying in 3 months like they're reading a bank balance.

Whether this all works or not I dont know...all I know is I don't want to be studying texas government as a bachelors requirement because Im moving state when Im done lol.

 

[MadSquabbles500]

If you graduate med school then do not do a residency then you are not allowed to treat a patient in hospital. You have to apply for a residency and this relies on proving yourself through achievements both extra curricular and academic. You dont get to go on a residency without the MD 'symbol'.

Not sure of your point here, are you saying healthcare should be 'on the job' without prior training? Even if I was to humor that...how do you choose who gets access to 'on the job training'...because the current system (that chooses people via status symbols of A grades and medical diplomas seems to work just fine).

I think a lot of things can be "on the job" . You caught me off guard with an extreme example.

I was more or less talking about most of the other subjects people study in American College. For most subjects, testing is just written test, or classroom lab (not something that will blow up whole building kind of deal). If you are employer seeking individual workers, you can just test them yourself. That will be the screening.

 

[rj144]

I think a lot of things can be "on the job" . You caught me off guard with an extreme example.

I was more or less talking about most of the other subjects people study in American College. For most subjects, testing is just written test, or classroom lab (not something that will blow up whole building kind of deal). If you are employer seeking individual workers, you can just test them yourself. That will be the screening.

Try working for NASA without a degree from a university.

 

[JinKazama]

as a stepping stone to grad school a lot of times

depends on what field, do some research don't waste time and money on garbage degrees