Crime Tyre Nichols video to be released soon. 5 Memphis cops fired and charged with murder for his death

[irish_thug]

If iirc, Kelly was breaking into cars and when officers found him, he was in the midst of delusion due to mental illness. They were looking for any excuse to pound the shit out of someone and they found it in Kelly’s behavior, I can’t remember much more about it

Was he the one that pulled out a cell phone and they thought is was a gun?

 

[USA!USA!]

So it's ok for cops to beat someone to death if he has a weapon and is a threat ??
So disarming and arresting is not a thing in the USA ?
No need for lawyers and judges, the cops can do it all.

If they have a gun and are a threat, police in America literally shoot them immediately, so I'd say if they are struggling with a guy who has a gun, they will beat the hell out of him until they were in the clear. That is obviously not what happened here though.

 

[GearSolidMetal]

Possibly. But you're also removing a root cause not making people want to join or stay at the department in the first place

Last night an annoying question that was constantly asked is 'Do you have any evidence releasing the tapes on Monday would be better than Friday?'

So I'm not going to ask 'Do you have any evidence having a policy for cops to rat on other cops would be good for recruitment?" But I will state some further research would aid your argument.

A major issue with retaining new recurits in LA Sheriff's is the dept has not bothered to eliminate gangs.

Gangs have infested LA for 50+ years. Do you think they've not tried to eliminate them? Whenever one gang is gone another is created or move into the old gangs territory.

It depends on the jurisdiction. You see the same problem with crime metrics, at a certain point cops are incentivized to downgrade the severity of crimes.

Yeah, that's a corruption issue with local politicians lying with statistics implying the crime rate goes down. Police chiefs serve at the digression of mayors so they either fall in line giving orders to their patrol cops or the mayors will find a chief that will.

And of course you can do something about unofficial policy. That's called culture and oversight. It's not easy but solutions to systemic problems are never easy.

Ok, you're not even proposing a policy change for this one, just 'culture and oversight.' That's not going to change shit when the problem is 'systemic.'

The problem your side has about law enforcement is you guys know absolutely nothing about it. No experience as a cop, or even education in law. But if there's one area of the nation that'd be open to such reforms it'd be California. They should be tried there first and if they work as promised with no unforeseen consequences then other areas of the country would adopt them.

Because passing federal laws in regard to local law enforcement isn't going to have the positive effects you guys think it would.

 

[avenue94]

If iirc, Kelly was breaking into cars and when officers found him, he was in the midst of delusion due to mental illness. They were looking for any excuse to pound the shit out of someone and they found it in Kelly’s behavior, I can’t remember much more about it

Yeah more or less. One of the cops used his flashlight as well. How the cops all walked without going to prison is one of the worst miscarriages of justice I've seen in recent memory.

 

[nhbbear]

I think it would make it easier for other people to understand how serious the problem is if they just understood that police departments are like any other work force. There will be bad behavior, asskissing, cliques, bending of rules, bad incentives, good incentives that backfire and get abused, etc. It just happens that the consequence are far worse.

Yeah, dirty cops can cause so much damage to someone’s life and in the community. So the consequences of dirty cops are bad. They lock up innocent people, increase distrust in the communities, ruin lives, end lives in some instances, steal, sell drugs and rob drug dealers, and make the job more difficult and dangerous for every other officer nationwide

 

[nhbbear]

Use of force that is proportionate to the circumstance. Considering him going for the shotgun could have resulted in a lawful shoot, I would say some facial rearrangement is justifiable.

Yeah, he earned that giant scar

 

[nhbbear]

Yeah more or less. One of the cops used his flashlight as well. How the cops all walked without going to prison is one of the worst miscarriages of justice I've seen in recent memory.

I agree. I was so disappointed and embarrassed to be a cop after seeing that one

 

[avenue94]

Last night an annoying question that was constantly asked is 'Do you have any evidence releasing the tapes on Monday would be better than Friday?'

So I'm not going to ask 'Do you have any evidence having a policy for cops to rat on other cops would be good for recruitment?" But I will state some further research would aid your argument.

You cite hate for cops as one of the reasons for poor supply of applicants. You improve behavior and their reputation with the public, hate goes down, you presumably get better recruitment long term.

Gangs have infested LA for 50+ years. Do you think they've not tried to eliminate them? Whenever one gang is gone another is created or move into the old gangs territory.

As in police gangs...

Ok, you're not even proposing a policy change for this one, just 'culture and oversight.' That's not going to change shit when the problem is 'systemic.'

As in appoint better people, appoint a DA equivalent to oversee departments that isn't at the mercy of elections. Changing culture is one of the most basic parts of tackling a systemic issue.

The problem your side has about law enforcement is you guys know absolutely nothing about it. No experience as a cop, or even education in law. But if there's one area of the nation that'd be open to such reforms it'd be California. They should be tried there first and if they work as promised with no unforeseen consequences then other areas of the country would adopt them.

Because passing federal laws in regard to local law enforcement isn't going to have the positive effects you guys think it would.

Consent degrees have vastly improved LAPD since Rampart. You know which dept didn't have a consent decree and operates like a criminal outfit, shaking down other police departments, kdnapping civilians, and has a widespread gang problem? LA Sheriffs.

Also solving the issue of bad cops being hired by other departments requires a federal solution. No other way around it.

 

[WklySportsMemes]

As I just said to micro, it was tough for me to believe there were so many dirty cops because I was honest and fair. I could never fathom cops abusing power like that until videos started coming out. I was warned by some in the community that so and so was dirty, and it was always taken with a grain of salt because the guys they mentioned had never shown me anything that would indicate it was true. You want to believe that it isn’t true. I know the overwhelming majority of cops are still good, but my eyes have been opened quite a bit since I am out of the profession

Interesting view point. Can appreciate the acknowledgment and honesty in this.
I think terms like "the majority of" get thrown around way too much and it helps to create the false narrative of it not being a huge or wide spread problem.
Plus there is no way to measure or track that.
The only generic unit of measuring for stuff like this is "too many. " It happens too many times & too often. Just for the ones that make the news too. This doesn't count all the cover ups, the ones that don't get the mainstream media coverage, & the everyday ones that get walked back or don't go left because of boot licking out of fear.

 

[PhitePhan]

To those who truly despise police in America, are black cops actually the equivalent of Jews who sympathized with and helped the nazis?

Is that really where we are here? I hope not...

 

[nhbbear]

Yeah more or less. One of the cops used his flashlight as well. How the cops all walked without going to prison is one of the worst miscarriages of justice I've seen in recent memory.

I have used my flashlight before but used it to strike the legs of a guy that just robbed someone with a gun

 

[Source]

I know. Does anyone know if he is still a cop?

I was going to look it up and got distracted. They were fired and as of his 2015 arrest for domestic violence (charges were dropped) it doesn’t appear that he was still an officer. They spent 10 years trying to get their jobs back. What they did to that man was unimaginable and grotesque.

https://voiceofoc.org/tag/manuel-ramos/?amp

https://www.ocregister.com/2021/03/...thomas-drop-their-fight-to-win-jobs-back/amp/

 

[nhbbear]

Interesting view point. Can appreciate the acknowledgment and honesty in this.
I think terms like "the majority of" get thrown around way too much and it helps to create the false narrative of it not being a huge or wide spread problem.
Plus there is no way to measure or track that.
The only generic unit of measuring for stuff like this is "too many. " It happens too many times & too often. Just for the ones that make the news too. This doesn't count all the cover ups, the ones that don't get the mainstream media coverage, & the everyday ones that get walked back or don't go left because of boot licking out of fear.

I still believe that the overwhelming majority of cops are good, but even a few dirty cops is too many.

 

[nhbbear]

I was going to look it up and got distracted. They were fired and as of his 2015 arrest for domestic violence (charges were dropped) it doesn’t appear that he was still an officer. They spent 10 years trying to get their jobs back. What they did to that man was unimaginable and grotesque.

https://voiceofoc.org/tag/manuel-ramos/?amp

https://www.ocregister.com/2021/03/...thomas-drop-their-fight-to-win-jobs-back/amp/

yeah, he didn’t even look human after what they did to him

 

[jrams]

Something like that would explain the overly emotional response out of the former officers.

Wouldn't you expect someone in the incident to acknowledge they know who someone is if this were the case? To me, it came across like Tyre didn't know the cops and none of the cops knew Tyre based on how they were interacting in a panic.

If I were a betting man, I'd assume this is just who they are, this is how they operate, and they've likely brutalized other people before.

 

[KAZSoliloquy]

Gangs have infested LA for 50+ years. Do you think they've not tried to eliminate them? Whenever one gang is gone another is created or move into the old gangs territory

it’s almost like crime isn’t a problem that can be solved by policing.

 

[jamel]

I don't know a thing about this Van Jones. I read the article. Mostly horseshit but IDK...you think he's just a guy who wants to stir shit up? Or does he believe it but just has a...bizarre way of seeing the world?

Depends on the neighborhood he resides in.

 

[jamel]

Wrong. The first police force was the NYPD which was established in 1845 after constables and volunteer night watchmen were unsuccessful in curbing crime. The NYPD was modeled after the London Metro Police. The slave catchers were more like bounty hunters and have little to do with modern day policing, which is based on peacekeeping and law enforcement.

I will agree with you that the cops in this story are a disgrace to their oath and badge and deserve everything that they get.

https://time.com/4779112/police-history-origins/
In the South, however, the economics that drove the creation of police forces were centered not on the protection of shipping interests but on the preservation of the slavery system. Some of the primary policing institutions there were the slave patrols tasked with chasing down runaways and preventing slave revolts, Potter says; the first formal slave patrol had been created in the Carolina colonies in 1704. During the Civil War, the military became the primary form of law enforcement in the South, but during Reconstruction, many local sheriffs functioned in a way analogous to the earlier slave patrols, enforcing segregation and the disenfranchisement of freed slaves.

 

[G-19]

And that's my point. The coverup is almost always worse than the ugly truth. Policing requires community buy in, if you stop releasing info the public wants, you lose the ability to police effectively.

Some of the five charged officers are members of the Scorpion unit, which is supposed to be an elite specialized anti-gang unit. The issue you see with a lot of these units (CRASH in LA, the antigun taskforce in Baltimore, etc) is that they seek out and reward aggressive candidates. There also tends to be a focus on stats and quantifiable metrics (how many arrests, how much cash seized, drugs seized, etc). These are obviously logical incentives, but if not careful you run into the issue of where an officer will be like, oh shit, Steve is 10 arrests ahead of me, I need to make up that gap so I get a promotion. It's the same issue you saw in the Vietnam War with body counts, it gives an incentive to inflate it if that's your metric of success.

Edit: There is also the trap of there is pressure for the unit to improve its performance every month, which is obviously impossible.

Thanks for the clarification. I get what you’re saying and you aren’t wrong either. When you’re on any kind of team the bosses expect you to justify your existence with metrics. If your performance is lacking they cut you and move on to the next guy.

My team watched the video together last night since we were on standby expecting at the very least large crowds in Chicago (never happened) and all walked away saying the same thing. How the hell did none of these guys even attempt to handcuff the victim? If he ran from them earlier and attempted to defeat their arrest where is the handcuffing at? When they just went straight to beating with zero attempt to properly detain him this looks like less like a police arrest gone wrong and more like a rogue team doing their thing. Once they started kicking him in the head most of us just walked away. Truly disgusting to see.

 

[Roaming East]

just to simmer you guys down.

They released the video on Friday because of economics. Its the end of the work week, so businesses get 2 days and a night for tension to calm so that business can carry on like normal the following Monday without protest or rioting interfering with customers and employees. Thats it. its about money.