Opinion What does "Make America Great Again" mean to you? And how do you see it being great again?

[Rob Battisti]

Any Country's "National Identity" should be as continuously evolving as its population does. That includes changing perspectives of each generation, and changing demographics due to migration. People who usually ardently oppose this notion are separatists and xenophobes who want ethno-States.

Evolving? I guess in the way that our national identity after 9/11 changed or after WWII. However, the basic tenants remain the same. When people say “Make America Great Again” they may be trying to get back to the tenants of earlier days or simply the ideals of the foundation of the country.

You still deny national identity exists?

Disharmony has always existed. One of the main issues with applying one identity to the United States is that the country has always been composed of several nations and their identities, under one state. This division has existed since the country's founding.

The country's adherence to some concept of a national identity in the 21st century is stronger than it was for most of our history.

E Pluribus Unum.

We have lost that.

 

[avenue94]

E Pluribus Unum.

We have lost that.

We never had that. What decades do you think this national spirit existed and where do you see this in primary sources?

 

[Rob Battisti]

We never had that. What decades do you think this national spirit existed and where do you see this in primary sources?

We never had an ideal of E Pluribus Unum? Literally stamped into our coinage?

“See this in primary sources” my goodness.

 

[Jack V Savage]

You could say communists or socialists are the minority. Fine.

Anti liberals(in the context you're using it) absolutley are not. On the HILL you're the 100% majority. That is not a reflection of American life and you are getting high on your own supply. Your arrogance blinds you completley to that.

See the point I made earlier. The superiority of liberalism is obvious. Even if Trump were able to end elections, for example, people would pretty much immediately see what a disaster it would be. There would be a lot of short-term hardship, but the system would be restored. It's not in place for any reason other than that it's better and people get to choose.

 

[BFoe]

Help us bring back the romanticized Republican Party of Ronald Regan;
In the process; we will own the Libs.



Pretty self explanatory

But Reagan is considered a RINO these days. You think they want to emulate Reagan’s amnesty for undocumented immigrants? Hell no.
You think they feel the same way about Russia as Reagan did? Clearly not.
You think they want to work with Dems to the degree Reagan did? Not a chance.

The only thing that the modern GOP seems to like about Reagan is his trickle down economics, and cutting social benefit programs.

 

[44nutman]

The funny thing is the majority of people that are going to vote for Trump because they like how he ran the country and thought he did a good job don't talk about Trump half as much as the people that actually suffer from TDS and can't go a whole day without mentioning his name.

You support trillion dollar deficits? Trump was the worst with deficits out of any non war President. I am not even talking about the COVID deficit. Dude was banging trillion dollar deficits pre COVID. The dumbest shit I have ever seen is when he cut taxes and increased spending, in a good economy. Still shaking my head over it and also shaking my head over Conservative media giving him a pass on it. Trump managed to spend more than Obama which I did not think would be possible, but Trump said hold my diaper when it came to spending.

 

[ferrisjso]

See the point I made earlier. The superiority of liberalism is obvious. Even if Trump were able to end elections, for example, people would pretty much immediately see what a disaster it would be. There would be a lot of short-term hardship, but the system would be restored. It's not in place for any reason other than that it's better and people get to choose.

No no it isn't. All the smartest people on earth fucking hate your system with a fucking passion. Albert Einstein wrote a pamplet titled "why socialism is the answer".

When this system goes its never coming back. I'm not at all confident socialism will succeed. Neoliberal market capitalism will die. Maybe not soon enough to save everyone. Its fate is sealed. And its sealed by people like you who believed so firmly in its superiority.

If you wanted people to choose you would allow socialists to run for office and not coup them if they won. Not just in America I mean globally. You know instead of killing democratically elected governments because they try protecting their people from you. Was what Kissinger did in Chile doing "letting people choose"? Or the new trick declaring peoples democratically elected governments terrorist organizations? You really believe in letting the people choose? I'm not saying I do(the Germans chose the Nazis fuck that shit) but I know you don't. You are full of absolutley blood riddled horse shit.

 

[avenue94]

We never had an ideal of E Pluribus Unum? Literally stamped into our coinage?

“See this in primary sources” my goodness.

Yeah, and the Declaration of Independence says "all men are created equal," despite very clearly not being true. Since when does putting something on coinage make it reality?

And yes, I asked about primary sources because it sounds like you have not read how Americans throughout the country's history thought of and spoke of themselves. For example, the Jefferson vs Hamilton debate very clearly speaks to a lack of national identity, but rather a country with multiple national identities. You would also find that for large periods of the 19th century, Americans were more likely to refer to themselves as citizens of a state and having a state identity before seeing themselves as Americans.

TLDR: Up until the Civil War, you were more likely to see the United States as a plural, not singular noun.

 

[ferrisjso]

You support trillion dollar deficits? Trump was the worst with deficits out of any non war President. I am not even talking about the COVID deficit. Dude was banging trillion dollar deficits pre COVID. The dumbest shit I have ever seen is when he cut taxes and increased spending, in a good economy. Still shaking my head over it and also shaking my head over Conservative media giving him a pass on it. Trump managed to spend more than Obama which I did not think would be possible, but Trump said hold my diaper when it came to spending.

Deficits are a fake issue. The govt has unlimited resources the reason the debt is an issue is to set up the taxpayer identity as a foil to socialism because that identity makes it seem like capitalists are paying for everything and that without capitalists we'll just run out of money. People are literally cheering for themselves being robbed and thinking its the opposite.

People advocating for deficit reduction(internationally this is called "austerity" but that doesn't test as well with focus groups) are advocating for violence. They might not KNOW they are advocating for violence. But they are advocating for violence.

 

[Rob Battisti]

Yeah, and the Declaration of Independence says "all men are created equal," despite very clearly not being true. Since when does putting something on coinage make it reality?

Which is another ideal and aspect our our national identity. Literally had a civil war to try to work toward that ideal.

You’re a clown.

 

[avenue94]

Which is another ideal and aspect our our national identity. Literally had a civil war to try to work toward that ideal.

You’re a clown.

OK, so what evidence do you find compelling to conclude that Americans had a singular national identity that superseded region and states in American history? Was it newspaper articles, a scholarly work on the matter (this is extensively studied), etc., what? Because it seems like you're flailing about because you have never engaged with the actual history of the country.

 

[Seano]

Yeah, and the Declaration of Independence says "all men are created equal," despite very clearly not being true. Since when does putting something on coinage make it reality?

huh, really? Please make a list of the folks you consider lesser than you.

 

[Jack V Savage]

No no it isn't. All the smartest people on earth fucking hate your system with a fucking passion. Albert Einstein wrote a pamplet titled "why socialism is the answer".

When this system goes its never coming back. I'm not at all confident socialism will succeed. Neoliberal market capitalism will die. Maybe not soon enough to save everyone. Its fate is sealed. And its sealed by people like you who believed so firmly in its superiority.

We shall see, I guess. I think you're going to die unhappy while most Americans continue to prosper.

 

[avenue94]

huh, really? Please make a list of the folks you consider lesser than you.

What are you going on about? I'm referring to that phrase in its contemporary context, not today.

 

[Jack V Savage]

Deficits are a fake issue. The govt has unlimited resources the reason the debt is an issue is to set up the taxpayer identity as a foil to socialism because that identity makes it seem like capitalists are paying for everything and that without capitalists we'll just run out of money. People are literally cheering for themselves being robbed and thinking its the opposite.

If you can just magically create resources, why would those evil capitalists care if regular people get any? If there is no scarcity, there's no need for conflict.

People advocating for deficit reduction(internationally this is called "austerity" but that doesn't test as well with focus groups) are advocating for violence. They might not KNOW they are advocating for violence. But they are advocating for violence.

No, the point of wanting deficit reduction now (with the economy running at full capacity) is to improve people's living standards.

 

[BFoe]

huh, really? Please make a list of the folks you consider lesser than you.

It seems pretty clear that he’s talking about “all men are created equal” being written into the Declaration in 1776, despite that not being the reality in the country at the time… and arguably ever. We should hopefully agree that African Americans were not treated equally for the first 190-ish years that this country existed, at a minimum.

 

[Rob Battisti]

OK, so what evidence do you find compelling to conclude that Americans had a singular national identity that superseded region and states in American history? Was it newspaper articles, a scholarly work on the matter (this is extensively studied), etc., what? Because it seems like you're flailing about because you have never engaged with the actual history of the country.

You serious?

 

[TeTe]

1. Eliminating Federal Income Tax.
2. Drastically reducing military spending and ending all involvement in wars and military aggression.
3. Eliminating all Privately funded prisons and releasing all non-violent offenders from all prisons and into some other form of rehabilitation.
4. Decriminalize all drug use and possession.
5. Get rid of Social Security and create a more privatized, individual retirement saving account plan for people. (this will help keep our stupid ass government from borrowing against it too).
6. Eliminate the Federal Minimum wage so we're not setting the bar so low and create better wage competition.
7. Allow Health Insurance companies to do business across the US instead of only in state and reduce the barriers to entry (making it more like car insurance) to create greater competition and reduce premiums and health care costs.
8. Eliminate EV mandates and let the market decide when and if we phase out ICE cars completely.

I'm sure I can think of many more.

 

[ferrisjso]

If you can just magically create resources, why would those evil capitalists care if regular people get any? If there is no scarcity, there's no need for conflict.

No, the point of wanting deficit reduction now (with the economy running at full capacity) is to improve people's living standards.

They want to undo social safety nets because it discourages people from serving them and makes them feel safe and secure and makes them feel less importance. Also while you've conceded on MMT when pushed your average neoliberal actually believes in monetarism. Theres a whole bunch of motives.

Austerity reduces peoples standards of living. This is pretty much universally agreed on even by many of your kind.

Also you can't magically create resources. But most of leftists wish doesn't require resources or is light on resources. Resources are the only limitation on the magic of MMT.

 

[Rob Battisti]

1. Eliminating Federal Income Tax.
2. Drastically reducing military spending and ending all involvement in wars and military aggression.
3. Eliminating all Privately funded prisons and releasing all non-violent offenders from all prisons and into some other form of rehabilitation.
4. Decriminalize all drug use and possession.
5. Get rid of Social Security and create a more privatized, individual retirement saving account plan for people. (this will help keep our stupid ass government from borrowing against it too).
6. Eliminate the Federal Minimum wage so we're not setting the bar so low and create better wage competition.
7. Allow Health Insurance companies to do business across the US instead of only in state and reduce the barriers to entry (making it more like car insurance) to create greater competition and reduce premiums and health care costs.
8. Eliminate EV mandates and let the market decide when and if we phase out ICE cars completely.

I'm sure I can think of many more.

Agree on everything except the drugs!