Crime Why the hell can't we do something like this?

You're not going to win an anecdote-off with healthcare horror stories from the US bud. 5 hour ER wait? Pfff. You say you would rather pay until your 2 day hospital stay or life saving surgery bankrupts you. You should stop while you're behind.
No, what I would rather is that there be two options. One socialized health care for those who can't afford private, and another option where you can get quicker and better service if you're willing and able to pay for it.
 
No, what I would rather is that there be two options. One socialized health care for those who can't afford private, and another option where you can get quicker and better service if you're willing and able to pay for it.
America already has this. If you are a low income earner you qualify for Medicaid and if you are over the age of 65 or have some sort of disability you qualify for Medicare. Also there are other governmental programs that offer medical services like if you are a veteran or CHIP if you have a child and do not qualify for Medicaid. The people who get destroyed by medical costs are people who choose to be un-insured (about 5% of the population) because they want to opt out and save the money on health insurance. And if something catastrophic happens, well that's why you want to have insurance in the first place.
 
Because we would fuck it up worse them any other country in the world.

Our system is far from perfect but there are disadvantages to nationalized heath care. Long wait times for needed service, and refused service. Overall care. This is already a problem in other countries. Basically we would say "hold my beer and watch how I can really fuck this up".

We need to work with improving what we have.
 
This is the way to do it. Of course, we can’t have this in the United States because it’s
Bad for business.

You'd think you guys could put the whole left/right thing on the shelf for this one issue and get it done. You have what are probably the best hospitals and doctors in the world.

I think the only thing between you and the best comprehensive health care anyone could ever want is the profit motive.
 
Because we would fuck it up worse them any other country in the world.

Our system is far from perfect but there are disadvantages to nationalized heath care. Long wait times for needed service, and refused service. Overall care. This is already a problem in other countries. Basically we would say "hold my beer and watch how I can really fuck this up".

We need to work with improving what we have.
Pretty much every other "first world" country has figured it out and makes it work. You don't need to make excuses for it. It's OK to admit our system exists because a massive for profit system is built around it. Even if you have health insurance in this country, the doctor doesn't even get the final say on your treatment a lot of the time. The good ole insurance man gets the pleasure of doing that.
 
We have a long history of the ultra wealthy brainwashing conservatives into believing that any attempt to use our wealth for the good of the people is evil communism and doomed to fail. I have no hope of that changing in our lifetime anymore
 
We have a long history of the ultra wealthy brainwashing conservatives into believing that any attempt to use our wealth for the good of the people is evil communism and doomed to fail. I have no hope of that changing in our lifetime anymore
And the most ironic part of all of it is a massive portion of the population/parts of the country that are against this would benefit the most from it.
 
You'd think you guys could put the whole left/right thing on the shelf for this one issue and get it done. You have what are probably the best hospitals and doctors in the world.

I think the only thing between you and the best comprehensive health care anyone could ever want is the profit motive.
My daughter stayed 4 nights in picu for RSV back when she was 3 yrs old. The bill to our insurance was 20k. We paid the out of pocket max on our policy of 6k. That was 4 years ago. Our insurance based system allows prices to get out of control.
 
Pretty much every other "first world" country has figured it out and makes it work. You don't need to make excuses for it. It's OK to admit our system exists because a massive for profit system is built around it. Even if you have health insurance in this country, the doctor doesn't even get the final say on your treatment a lot of the time. The good ole insurance man gets the pleasure of doing that.

And you thing doctors in national heath care get the final say.

Of course the for profit has some real problems and we need to work on them.

Look at the problem s in most of the countries with national heath care. Starring with the tax rate for the service provided.
 
You'd think you guys could put the whole left/right thing on the shelf for this one issue and get it done. You have what are probably the best hospitals and doctors in the world.

I think the only thing between you and the best comprehensive health care anyone could ever want is the profit motive.
I mean, I think anyone with a brain knows it’s not a left and right issue. It’s a money in politics issue and a capitalist issue.
 
We have a long history of the ultra wealthy brainwashing conservatives into believing that any attempt to use our wealth for the good of the people is evil communism and doomed to fail. I have no hope of that changing in our lifetime anymore

The majority of Americans now want universal healthcare. That's a start.
 
And you thing doctors in national heath care get the final say.

Of course the for profit has some real problems and we need to work on them.

Look at the problem s in most of the countries with national heath care. Starring with the tax rate for the service provided.
It never ceases to amaze me when there are dirt poor people (not saying you are one of them) shitting on socialized health care saying "LOOK AT THE LONG WAIT TIMES" and other crap while if they get sick, get cancer, have an emergency, etc and stuff like wait times don't matter because they are fucked. It's either go into massive debt, stay sick/die, or maybe start a gofundme.

Another reason the wait time excuse is stupid is because we have the same shit here. Sure, I can get into my PCP relatively quick but if they say I need to see a specialist? That's likely going to be a several week or even multiple month long wait. The only people our system is the best for is the rich, like so many of the shit systems in our country.
 
You'd think you guys could put the whole left/right thing on the shelf for this one issue and get it done. You have what are probably the best hospitals and doctors in the world.

I think the only thing between you and the best comprehensive health care anyone could ever want is the profit motive.
But the right doesn't want anything like that. It is inevitably a left/right issue. The liberal strategy has been to try to approximate the results carefully, and it has A) improved things a lot (Medicare for the elderly, Medicaid expansion for the poor, CHIP for kids in families that are struggling but not enough to qualify for Medicaid, regs and incentives for workers, exchanges and subsidies for people not in traditional group markets) and B) met with massive, continuing resistance from the right.
 
I already get this

Also I doubt colonoscopy is annual
 
But the right doesn't want anything like that. It is inevitably a left/right issue. The liberal strategy has been to try to approximate the results carefully, and it has A) improved things a lot (Medicare for the elderly, Medicaid expansion for the poor, CHIP for kids in families that are struggling but not enough to qualify for Medicaid, regs and incentives for workers, exchanges and subsidies for people not in traditional group markets) and B) met with massive, continuing resistance from the right.

It doesn't have to be that way.

Plenty of conservative voters want these things and are distracted with culture war nonsense. I don't think I have ever heard a Democrat even try to reach out to them diplomatically.

Biden tried initially but honestly, he isn't an inspiring speaker.
 
The only thing I'm worried about is if it's free, then literally everyone would be going to the doctor every week for every little thing

As expensive as it is now, even rich people such as myself, have to wait weeks to see a doctor, then wait a month to see the specialist the doctor referred you to, then wait 2 weeks to get a blood work done, then wait a week to get results, then wait 3 weeks to see the first doctor to go over your results, then wait a month to see the specialist that can treat whatever the bloodwork showed, then wait 4 months to see the first doctor to go over the efficacy of the treatment.
 
My daughter stayed 4 nights in picu for RSV back when she was 3 yrs old. The bill to our insurance was 20k. We paid the out of pocket max on our policy of 6k. That was 4 years ago. Our insurance based system allows prices to get out of control.

I liked your post to thank you for your input, but it always feels wrong to like that kind of story. These prices are insane.
 
Plenty of conservative voters want these things and are distracted with culture war nonsense. I don't think I have ever heard a Democrat even try to reach out to them diplomatically.
I suspect whatever it is you're putting into "diplomatically" is doing unreasonably heavy lifting there. It should be pretty apparent that the general cultural divide can't be solved with nice words. The fact that there even is a culture war should serve as a very strong indicator of that, and an aspect of that culture war is taking any attempt to extend the olive branch and twist it into the opposite. Remember when Republicans were outraged when Biden criticized die-hard Trump supporters?
 
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