International Russia/Ukraine Megathread V8

[Streeter]

Russia will never accept the result if they lose, you said it yourself, they are humilliated, having elections where people vote fuck Russia would not fix that.

Also just like Russia has been humilliated so has Ukraine, with all those war crimes, there can be no reconciliation without reparations.



Maybe but the security guarantees needed would be probably too much for Russia to accept, Ukraine would need NATO troops stationed in the border with Russia, a DMZ and a bunch of Western weapons, would Russia accept that?



Like the Budapest memorandum?

Fool me once...

Well the treaty has more teeth now Russia is not going into Ukraine again. They want no more o that smoke

Imo your too concerned with right n wrong. Of course Russia is wrong here and should pay a heavy price. That's not the point. If there is a way to end this where all sides can walk away saying they won that's what needs to get done.

 

[syct23]

At this point I just hope the Democrats stop sending billions of dollars over there

You do realize that it trickles back down..

 

[Rod1]

Countries don't choose paths. People do. When Gorbachev destroyed his own country the common people there had no choice or saying. They never had any chance of electing a proper leader, or a congress. You had millions of people who had no idea what democracy was, no other institutions(no real judiciary, no real investigative powers). It take decades to build that.
So, from that country only a few people had any saying in how Russia would progress forward.

Again, what "long history" of democracy was there on any ex-soviet or Yugoslavian nation? none.

Poland didn't had any more opportunities than Russia did, neither did Ukraine despite all the meddling by Russia.

The people at large probably elected some decent people but there was nothing stopping gangsters such as Putin from taking over by force or by rigging elections(as most early russian elections were probably rigged).

And the USSR had a system that would prevent such a thing? Its ironic you claim "countries don't choose paths, people do" and then blame the rise of Putin on Gorbachev.

There was nobody to stop stupid programs such as loans for shares.
These other countries you mention kept some of their institutions and had enormous help from outside.

Russia had enourmous help from the outside too and there would had been more if they had so willed it, just like East Germany got help, how Poland got help etc, etc.

On the other hand, foreign powers were more interest in looting Russia. Most of these oligarchs had connections in the UK, Israel or the US, and these countries didn't care either, they eagerly accepted their dirty money.

This is BS, the people who looted Russia were Russians not foreigners.

In fact, Putin is still somewhat popular because he stopped the worst western backed oligarchs such as Boris Berezovsky. And yes, the UK gave that criminal political asylum because they thought it was unfair he was being tried for looting billions out of state companies.

And that's the crux of the issue, Russians just can't into civilized world, so they rejected Gorbachev idea of a modern Russia, similar to how they rejected Alexander II reforms or how the Bolsheviks came to power.

Its quite asinine and outright insulting to call Gorbachev at traitor just because he tried to improve Russia and not let it become the shithole that has become today.

 

[Rod1]

Well the treaty has more teeth now Russia is not going into Ukraine again. They want no more o that smoke

What kind of teeth? you said yourself that Ukraine would need to remain neutral.

Imo your too concerned with right n wrong. Of course Russia is wrong here and should pay a heavy price. That's not the point. If there is a way to end this where all sides can walk away saying they won that's what needs to get done.

Yet you are only asking for one side to compromise because the other side may nuke the world because they can't compromise.

 

[Yehudim]

Well the treaty has more teeth now Russia is not going into Ukraine again. They want no more o that smoke

Imo your too concerned with right n wrong. Of course Russia is wrong here and should pay a heavy price. That's not the point. If there is a way to end this where all sides can walk away saying they won that's what needs to get done.

Does your theoretical peace deal include Russia returning all occupied territories including Crimea, or does it include a vote on joining Russia with men in ski masks and kalashnikovs near the election booths?

I don’t think there’s a sane person alive who opposes an end to the war that includes a complete Russian withdrawal, but the peaceniks strangely never bring that up as an option.

 

[Rod1]

Holy fuck that guy got killed.

Guy dumped the magazine on him, got jumpy maybe?

 

[Terry Noonan]

Saw a video of fighting in the Forrest. 2 guys ina. Foxhole and they die about 10x over.

 

[Rholk]

Guy dumped the magazine on him, got jumpy maybe?

A realistic reaction tho, especially at that range.
Contact reaction in Afghanistan/Iraq was usually pretty similar to this, at way longer ranges

 

[KnightTemplar]

Guy dumped the magazine on him, got jumpy maybe?

Reminds me of the time a Florida sheriff's SWAT team caught up a criminal who had shot a K9 officer and killed his dog. The ME stopped counting at 70 GSW's. When asked at a press conference if he thought this was excessive force, the Sheriff replied,

"Hell, no! In fact, the only reason we stopped shooting him was we ran out of ammo and had to reload!"

 

[GhostZ06]

 

[Rod1]

A realistic reaction tho, especially at that range.
Contact reaction in Afghanistan/Iraq was usually pretty similar to this, at way longer ranges

Yeah, i guess so, adrenaline going high guy probably kept pushing the trigger.

 

[GhostZ06]

Ok, so if you want proof on how bad it is for the russians in the south. A UA tank is attacking a manned bm27 which are always postioned in the rear.





Tank vs tank combat

 

[Ruthless Ryan]

At this point I just hope the Democrats stop sending billions of dollars over there

Why? So Russia can mount a comeback and extend the war even longer? Russia needs to be defeated and not rewarded for invading , destroying and killing 10's of thousands of people on both sides.

 

[GhostZ06]

Why? So Russia can mount a comeback and extend the war even longer? Russia needs to be defeated and not rewarded for invading , destroying and killing 10's of thousands of people on both sides.

They cant even supply they're army in large scale operations, theyre corruption has royal fucked them to the bitter end.

 

[Ruthless Ryan]

They cant even supply they're army in large scale operations, theyre corruption has royal fucked them to the bitter end.

Yep, they have fallen off the tracks big time and I hope the minimum they lose for this invasion is for the Ukraine to get the Crimea back. It sounds simple but countries need to be punished for this kinda thing, the same way Germany was after WW2 ....with a loss of territory.

 

[Boxiana]

I find it disturbing what I (or the average kid) can watch in a couple of clicks on Twitter with no filters, warnings or restrictions.

That’s progress.

 

[SandisLL]

Ok, so if you want proof on how bad it is for the russians in the south. A UA tank is attacking a manned bm27 which are always postioned in the rear.





Tank vs tank combat

Yeah.

Usual tactique to use Grad or Uragan MRLS launchers is....
To locate them at least 10km from target...
Usually 2-4-8-20 launchers delivers salvos and then ASAP are relocated from point from where they had launched MRLS...
ASAP....
Range of Grad type 122mm missiles is usually 25 km or a bit more. Improved versions might have 40-42 km range...
Uragan...
USSR era Uragan 220mm missiles are with 35 km range....
Claimed improved more modern missiles are claimed that might have 65 km range.

Smerch missiles: USSR era models till 90km.
Claimed improved stuff till 100-120 km.

__
Why such launchers appeared closer than 10 km to frontline I have no clue....

 

[Streeter]

I don’t think there’s a sane person alive who opposes an end to the war that includes a complete Russian withdrawal, but the peaceniks strangely never bring that up as an option.

Because Putin won't just leave tail tucked and concede thus its not an option . Lol I'm not a peacenik I'm a realist .

 

[Rod1]

Reminds me of the time a Florida sheriff's SWAT team caught up a criminal who had shot a K9 officer and killed his dog. The ME stopped counting at 70 GSW's. When asked at a press conference if he thought this was excessive force, the Sheriff replied,

"Hell, no! In fact, the only reason we stopped shooting him was we ran out of ammo and had to reload!"

Yeah, but i would assume in a conventional war ammo conservation would be a thing, cops can always drive back to the station and get more ammo, a squad of soldiers may not.

But then again, i don't know the context of the video, it may just be a mop up operation.

 

[Rod1]

I find it disturbing what I (or the average kid) can watch in a couple of clicks on Twitter with no filters, warnings or restrictions.

That’s progress.

The old internet is back Bart, remember the old internet gore videos? they are back, in Ukraine war form.

Even Reddit doesn't gives a shit about censoring Ukraine war, corporations don't want the backlash of being seen as pro-Russian by censoring war videos.