Social Can homeless people be fined for sleeping outside? A rural Oregon city asks the US Supreme Court

[Sinister]

Correlation does not prove causation.

While housing is definitely a factor, you can't discount the fact that urban centers, especially wealthy liberal urban centers, are where resources for the homeless exist most (shelters, soup kitchens, health centers, hand-outs from bleeding hearts, drugs, etc. ).

There's also the gray area where drug or alcohol addiction may not have caused the person to become homeless, but it ultimately causes them to REMAIN homeless.

I was going to say something similar to this, the thing about homelessness and drug addiction is that drug addiction is often used as a discriminatory measure against the homeless. Like there arent functional drug addicts who work and are housed, or who have the benefit of being prescribed their addictive substance by Doctors. Then there is, are they homeless because they're drug addicts or are they drug addicts because they're homeless? Some want to feel drug addiction is a simple as a moral failure, but that's not always the case.

Some of the worst areas in the US for drug addiction are plagued by disinvestment, which means something like illegal drug use becomes the dominant local economy, and everyone else just avoids the area. I saw a video about Kensington PA where the guy actually interviewed residents (didnt just show their destitution), and a few of them said they had lost jobs, they had no economic opportunities, no means to move...and drugs are plentiful. You can make money, and then spend the money on something they see as a remedy for the depression. Then once the area is a cesspool its seen as unworthy of investment. That's one way that cycle then perpetuates.

 

[LeonardoBjj]

Man.. I watched it all go to hell. Took my daughter to a playground and and a homeless man, 6'6" with crazy red hair holding a two liter bottle of orange soda and in the other hand a knife.


Yeesh, California became hell in a decade.

- I watched bodybuilding videos from California. Guys were training, and theres several tents around them. But i dont have the guts to destroy things from people that have nothing!

 

[LeonardoBjj]

I was going to say something similar to this, the thing about homelessness and drug addiction is that drug addiction is often used as a discriminatory measure against the homeless. Like there arent functional drug addicts who work and are housed, or who have the benefit of being prescribed their addictive substance by Doctors. Then there is, are they homeless because they're drug addicts or are they drug addicts because they're homeless? Some want to feel drug addiction is a simple as a moral failure, but that's not always the case.

Some of the worst areas in the US for drug addiction are plagued by disinvestment, which means something like illegal drug use becomes the dominant local economy, and everyone else just avoids the area. I saw a video about Kensington PA where the guy actually interviewed residents (didnt just show their destitution), and a few of them said they had lost jobs, they had no economic opportunities, no means to move...and drugs are plentiful. You can make money, and then spend the money on something they see as a remedy for the depression. Then once the area is a cesspool its seen as unworthy of investment. That's one way that cycle then perpetuates.

- Several become drug addicts here, but after they're already living on the streets. Isn't like theres to much things for them to do.

Now alcool on the other hand, is a big responsible for people becoming homeless here.

 

[LeonardoBjj]

Isn't Fentynal more of a cutting agent, though?

- I thought was a filler.
@Protectandserve and @nhbbear

 

[Protectandserve]

- I thought was a filler.
@Protectandserve and @nhbbear

I’m definitely not the person to ask. I fucking hate dealing with dope.

Fentanyl itself is the narcotic that causes the effect. The other shit in there is the filler.

Fentanyl is just way cheaper to produce than heroin, which has driven some of the change to it. It also happens to be much much stronger in its effects.

 

[LeonardoBjj]

I’m definitely not the person to ask. I fucking hate dealing with dope.

Fentanyl itself is the narcotic that causes the effect. The other shit in there is the filler.

Fentanyl is just way cheaper to produce than heroin, which has driven some of the change to it. It also happens to be much much stronger in its effects.

- Thank you.

 

[nhbbear]

- I thought was a filler.
@Protectandserve and @nhbbear

Fentanyl started as a filler but became more popular and is now what everyone wants-that, cut with traq has overtaken many large cities.

As a district commander, I was hooked into an app run by the dea that showed waves of overdoses that looked like weather map. You could see it moving across the state like a weather front depending on where your drug hub was. We always thought getting word out that a bad batch of fentanyl would keep people cautious, but they actually sought out the bad shit just to get high

 

[lifelessheap]

- I watched bodybuilding videos from California. Guys were training, and theres several tents around them. But i dont have the guts to destroy things from people that have nothing!

I lived in Chico and Paradise in California. The homeless did not deserve respect or empathy. They were violent and aggressive and took over everything. Bidwell Park is one of the best parks in the US. It is huge. It became unusable due to violence and rape. Every playground became unusable. Why the hell do the homeless take over playgrounds ment for toddlers and kids?! They polluted the creeks and rivers. They stabbed to death people who wouldn't give them money.

You don't understand the reality of living with it and the filth and real danger.

 

[chardog]

I lived in Chico and Paradise in California. The homeless did not deserve respect or empathy. They were violent and aggressive and took over everything. Bidwell Park is one of the best parks in the US. It is huge. It became unusable due to violence and rape. Every playground became unusable. Why the hell do the homeless take over playgrounds ment for toddlers and kids?! They polluted the creeks and rivers. They stabbed to death people who wouldn't give them money.

You don't understand the reality of living with it and the filth and real danger.

they took over those areas because they could, they are people looking for opportunity, and you give them an inch, they take 2.5 miles.

do good karens keep them around by giving them assistance. My wife was complaining about the homeless while giving them bottled water, food, and tarps......... why would they leave? Eventually, the city passed a no camping ordinance and they were gone overnight.

Some try to stay around, and they do it by going place to place, but I cant imagine that being sustainable. There are shelters nearby, but they to be unoccupied, at least during the day it seems that way.

 

[DoctorTaco]

Portland, a city of just 650K

2.5 million people in the Portland metro area.

 

[Madmick]

2.5 million people in the Portland metro area.

Sure. If we quoted the total homeless for the MSA the number would change, also.

 

[Seano]

- Several become drug addicts here, but after they're already living on the streets. Isn't like theres to much things for them to do.

Maybe they could, you know, get a job or try to be a productive member of their community? Stop having such low expectations for these people.

 

[DoctorTaco]

then by all means

 

[Corona]

Fining them for sleeping on the street does seem like a stretch. Instead they should just fine them for mass littering, harassment, exposing themselves in public, public intoxication and disturbing the peace. You know things that are already illegal.

 

[DoctorTaco]

Sure. If we quoted the total homeless for the MSA the number would change, also.

Sure, but not by 4x. People live in the burbs and city, homeless congregate primarily in the city.

 

[Madmick]

Sure, but not by 4x. People live in the burbs and city, homeless congregate primarily in the city.

Yes, but the budget figures I quoted aren't for the MSA, either. You're introducing an orange to an apple.

 

[chrisdiaz]

Its interesting that they never mention the percentage of homeless that are drug addicted or mentally ill, likely both. I would say its about 80%

 

[DoctorTaco]

Yes, but the budget figures I quoted aren't for the MSA, either. You're introducing an orange to an apple.

I live in Portland and am adding some important context to those stats and numbers, you dingus.

 

[Lucas1980]

Fining them for sleeping on the street does seem like a stretch. Instead they should just fine them for mass littering, harassment, exposing themselves in public, public intoxication and disturbing the peace. You know things that are already illegal.

Yep enforce the existing laws and the homeless won't grow like wildfires....don't give them an inch.

 

[Madmick]

I live in Portland and am adding some important context to those stats and numbers, you dingus.

Then calculate the total amount spent on supportive housing in the Portland MSA. You're talking about a massive area, one that is nearly 7,000 square miles, an area that is larger than Connecticut, one that actually extends into Washington, and includes other actual municipalities with their own budgets: Salem (the state Capital), Hillsboro, Albany, Longview, Corvallis. It's not like you're talking about the woods. They have downtown areas, too, and plenty of their own homeless.