GSP's wrestling now that the Caucasians have taken over?

[GreatSaintGuillotine]

Still great. The stock of being ncaa div 1 has gone down but GSP is still undeniably phenomenal i. The wrestling department

 

[Poatan Power]

GSP was a very good wrestler but was his opposition that good ( MMA grappling wise)?

...who are D1 level wrestlers? lol

This new breed of grapplers are not simply top game wrestlers. They have integrated ground and pound and submissions WHILE improving position seamlessly, which is something the last few generations didn't do. GSP, Sonnen, etc. would work from guard, half guard, open guard, etc. and ground and pound from there. This new seamless integration of all things MMA is really cool.

That being said, previous styles of wrestling still work well.

 

[Maori]

Khamzat beat a D1 wrestler in the first round by taking him down on his first attempt and pounding him out. I remember GSP having long drawn-out fights with his D1 wrestlers.

GSPs fought some of the best wrestlers in WW history, Khamzats fought ?????

 

[KlLLEmAll]

I mentioned it in my OP, so yes I realise.

No you didn't. I'm saying GSP actually trained with the people you talk of.

 

[Juan Bombadil]

GSP is the goat

 

[Grandwizard666]

I think really GSP's big talent was his ability to time his shots, the way he worked it into his standup to the degree he could catch someone coming forward.

The two best ever at that for me remain GSP and Arona.

This 100%
Gsp was never a khabib pressure type wrestler. He wasn't going to win straight wrestling matches against the elites of his division either. He out wrestled them in mma because of his complete skill set and insane set up/timing abilities. We will never know, but he very well could have pulled off the same tactics against these high level Dagestani guys.
Regardless, gsp = goat

 

[Grandwizard666]

Important to note, the level of wrestling in GSPs day was much higher and grappling much more focused on. Khabib? Hasn't exactly fought good wrestlers, in Bagov and Tibau he struggled for takedowns.

Penn
Hughes
Koscheck
Hendricks
Sherk
Fitch
Shields

GSP had to fight elite grapplers and wrestlers who were also legitimate top 10 contenders. Islam wasn't dominant vs Tsarukyan or Moises with wrestling like he was with Dober or Hooker...I wonder why?

Khamzats best win is a 18-7 fighter who was outwrestled and controlled by Magny and Jake Matthews (who?).

They are aggressive and dominant though, but they arent exactly going up against well suited opposition.

Dagestanis are a hot ticket for Dana's butt buddies in Dubai. That market is huge for him. He is going to actually promote these guys unlike any other fighter who he'll just bash. So favorable matchups all day.
This doesn't diminish the talent of these guys. But khabib fought mainly strikers. Islam is ranked like number 5 and probably higher based off beating Drew dober and Dan hooker.. and khamzat is apparently going to be top ten after beating fringe 15 dudes.
It's the fad right now.

 

[Tapioca Cold]

GSP was a very good wrestler but was his opposition that good ( MMA grappling wise)?

They were the best at the time. Lol. Go to school.

 

[Andy Capp]

GSP was a very good wrestler but was his opposition that good ( MMA grappling wise)?

 

[Sean Ryan]

Yep GSP was so good at MMA because thats what he was a fluid mix of martial arts not showing any real weakness in any area

I think it was more to do with his honesty to himself. Mentally on a different level. He knew what he was good at and what he wasn't good at.
He fought to his strengths.
He was always called boring by some but he wasn't going to be cowed by moronic fans or the UFC.

 

[PicoPulse]

I think it was more to do with his honesty to himself. Mentally on a different level. He knew what he was good at and what he wasn't good at.
He fought to his strengths.
He was always called boring by some but he wasn't going to be cowed by moronic fans or the UFC.

Hey you didnt hear it from me but *looks around*
he was kinda boring sometimes

 

[DoubleTrouble]

...who are D1 level wrestlers? lol

This new breed of grapplers are not simply top game wrestlers. They have integrated ground and pound and submissions WHILE improving position seamlessly, which is something the last few generations didn't do. GSP, Sonnen, etc. would work from guard, half guard, open guard, etc. and ground and pound from there. This new seamless integration of all things MMA is really cool.

That being said, previous styles of wrestling still work well.

Not denigrating D1 per se but in terms of MMA grappling were they that good? (more referring to Kos,Fitch and those type of guys).

If a guy with zero wrestling can train with the Canadian team and then just merk them on the mat, not sure how good they really were if that makes sense.

 

[DoubleTrouble]

They were the best at the time. Lol. Go to school.

That doesn't mean they were that good though does it.

 

[Substance Abuse]

Khamz beats Li who is not a good grappler and his wrestling is better than Georges'?

This forum is hilarious these days...

 

[The Chosen]

What's crazy is his background is actually Karate. Never had high school/collegiate wrestling experience, and never wrestled until he started MMA. Meanwhile, this wrestling skill of his is being compared to the guys of today who have been doing it since they were like 4. I think that's just something worth pointing out. It reflects his pure talent and skill, and the work he's put in on how fast he learned to reach a certain level though he didn't started at a very young age. If his MMA wrestling has been widely considered as one of the best for years, could you imagine if he started doing it when he was a kid?

He wanted to compete on Canada’s olympic wrestling team too when he started learning, GSP is probably the greatest athlete the sport has seen

 

[fortheo]

GSP had good timing and had a explosive double leg but would get mauled by these guys

No he wouldn't. He also had very high level BJJ to go along with it. Nobody was going to maul Prime gsp in MMA grappling.

 

[moreorless87]

The closest newer fighter to GSP for me is actually Nemkov, basically most comfortable throwing 1-2 strikes from mid/long range and then timing takedowns on opponents.

 

[fortheo]

UFC has abandoned American wrestlers, they're all going to Belator.

The idea that American D1 wrestlers can't compete with the Wrestlers from the caucus region is nonsense. Gables just ran through the Olympics without breaking a sweat, and is still going for his 4th national title.

Sadly, North American talent isn't in high demand in the UFC unless you have rainbow colored hair.

There's a lot of truth to this. These caucus guys are great, but they're not doing anything mind blowing. There are grapplers from several other countries who are on that level, but it just seems like the UFC is trying to tap into that russian/dagestani market at the moment.

 

[TheMessiah]

No he wouldn't. He also had very high level BJJ to go along with it. Nobody was going to maul Prime gsp in MMA grappling.

Hendricks bullied GSP in the clinch and took him down. And he was a D1 Wrestler who don't compare to these Chechens/Dagestanis

 

[fortheo]

Hendricks bullied GSP in the clinch and took him down. And he was a D1 Wrestler who don't compare to these Chechens/Dagestanis

Hendricks didn't bully GSP in the grappling. You're being hyperbolic. And Hendricks isn't just some D1 wrestler -- The guy was one of the best Collegiate wrestlers that the UFC has ever seen. Neither khabib nor islam have faced a wrestler of that caliber in the UFC.