How stupid do you have to be to believe that grounded knees are too "dangerous" to be allowed?

[Doctor Grudge]

High kicks are hard to land. Standing knees land once flush and the guy is down. Grounded knees are very dangerous. Plus so many dqs cause back of the head from failed takedowns into knees. Put your head down it lands illegaly.

Grounded knees are hard to land too lol...if it were easy to put your opponent in a position where you could knee them into unconsciousness fights' wouldn't last very long.

No one is leaving their head out there for people to punt it with their feet or knee. It isn't an easy position to get into, it's as ridiculous as saying mounted punches and elbows are too dangerous.

 

[stronghulk]

I think they should be legal. But I get the feeling that getting hit at the top of the head in some positions could injure the neck in ways other strikes don't.

 

[Mohawk Banditó]

I disagree. You can see by the video that no one (besides being possible, but its not that frequent) was put out by just one grounded knee, because they aren't that powerfull on those positions. Grounded knees, IMO, don't seems to be more concusive than grounded elbows. Tbh, i would love to see data on this, in that case, comparing concusions after tkos from grounded knees X grounded elbows. On the street fight part, i mean, knees aren't more street than elbows. Stomps and kicks are.

But that is bad reffing. Happens a lot in ufc as well. Fighters getting strong ground pound (sometimes being out and receiving elbows in the face) and taking long naps.

Knees are more powerful than elbows

 

[DonkeyKong]

Grounded elbows are FAR FAR more dangerous. That is due a simple fact: elbows can be landed way faster, the same happens with hammer fists. Hence, it's common to see fighters knocked OUT receiving 2 or 3 elbows clean in the face. The same does not happen with knees, because they are way slower to throw. Grounded knees will give to us more dynamic fights, with takedowns being risker to attempt, but, at same time, more rewarding. If you desagree, please, explain to me why i am wrong. Here is the videos that prove my point. I know, highligts don't tell the whole story. Maybe they look more brutal, because there is more TKO's by elbows. However, i think, by those videos, you can see my point.

You should watch Ricardo Arona vs. Kazushi Sakuraba. That will give you a concrete example.

 

[NenadRS]

And up kicks should be allowed, it just comes naturally to do it in some positions, really no reason to limit fighters at bottom to defend themselves.

 

[HeffDoesWant]

While you have POS people like Hendo in the sport you can't have grounded knees.

Both fighters properly grounded I'm OK with.

But idea of Hendo style late kicks and knees on unconscious fighters makes me totally ok with the current rule set.

 

[HeffDoesWant]

And up kicks should be allowed, it just comes naturally to do it in some positions, really no reason to limit fighters at bottom to defend themselves.

I'd like that, perhaps a rule about part of your torso being on the ground could make it workable.

 

[Mulletenthusiast]

Knees are more powerful than elbows

Yes, they are. They are slower as well. Recieving elbows in your face while being out ain't that secure as well. Knees can be stoped before the fighter is out (of course, you need a good ref to that).

 

[mbeethoven]

I disagree. You can see by the video that no one (besides being possible, but its not that frequent) was put out by just one grounded knee, because they aren't that powerfull on those positions. Grounded knees, IMO, don't seems to be more concusive than grounded elbows. Tbh, i would love to see data on this, in that case, comparing concusions after tkos from grounded knees X grounded elbows. On the street fight part, i mean, knees aren't more street than elbows. Stomps and kicks are.

But that is bad reffing. Happens a lot in ufc as well. Fighters getting strong ground pound (sometimes being out and receiving elbows in the face) and taking long naps.

Was NOT bad reffing. The guy on bottom wasnt even in any trouble at that point. It was ONE knee to the head that scrambled his brain.

Thats how I remember it anyway? Its been a few years so maybe memory is a bit off but it doesnt change the fact that a knee to the head changed that guy forever....

 

[Mulletenthusiast]

Was NOT bad reffing. The guy on bottom wasnt even in any trouble at that point. It was ONE knee to the head that scrambled his brain.

Thats how I remember it anyway? Its been a few years so maybe memory is a bit off but it doesnt change the fact that a knee to the head changed that guy forever....

Well, punches did the same, elbows did the same. We need data. I think is fair to compare concusions rate with knees vs without knees. But, IMO, the numbers will not change that much.

 

[Mohawk Banditó]

Yes, they are. They are slower as well. Recieving elbows in your face while being out ain't that secure as well. Knees can be stoped before the fighter is out (of course, you need a good ref to that).

So then your ultimate point isn't the actual danger of the strike, but more the precognitive abilities of the refs

 

[ryun253]

What was the old pride fight where someone was using both their knees to pound the others head in on the ground?

It wasn't coleman / igor

At least I don't think

Arona vs Sakuraba?

 

[HNIC215]

@Young Calf Kick i just came from your “there are less retarded threads on Sherdog” post to this retarded ass thread

 

[Mulletenthusiast]

So then your ultimate point isn't the actual danger of the strike, but more the precognitive abilities of the refs

My point is that fast strikes are dangerous as well. It's not because knees can be landed with more force that they are more warmful. I mean, you can be fucked by receiving three elbows in the face while being out. And, IMO, if a ref let someone receive three knees in the face while out, that person should be BANNED from reffing. Knees are more powerfull, but slower. In the great scheme of things, i think the "dangerousness" of those strikes even out.

 

[markys00]

As stupid as most sherdoggers.. especially those crying about fighter pay

 

[Mulletenthusiast]

I think they should be legal. But I get the feeling that getting hit at the top of the head in some positions could injure the neck in ways other strikes don't.

That is a good take. But neck cranks and guilhotines, imo, are more dangerous to spine. So, i think it's not more riskier than other movements. So, why banned it?

 

[gotBooched]

Arona vs Sakuraba?

Thanks, but not it.

I'm envisioning someone having side control and kneeing the person on bottom like - imagine tapping your fingers. Left, right, left, right, it was like 1-2, rest, 1-2, rest and toward the end the person on bottom was out

 

[acannxr]

Knees in north south are brutal as fuck. Which making grounded knees illegal makes north south an absolutely useless position, hence why you never see it anymore. (North south) I remember randleman reigning knees down on some japanese dude in north south in pride. It was brutal. I think that's the only position knees on the ground are potentially more dangerous. I think knees should be legal along with stomps, soccer kick and upkicks. This isn't ballet. this isn't soccer or tennis. Knees and upkicks should be legal at the least. OneFC got rid of soccer kicks and stomps because they knew at least one us state would allow knees and upkicks but wouldn't all stomps/soccer kicks. (Colorado knees to the head on the ground and upkicks are legal) the only state I think.

If we could get a big state like California, Texas and Florida to legalize knees to the head on the ground. It would be massive.

Or what about when Coleman ended Vovchanchyn's streak:

 

[theleerygoose]

The whole thing used to be that the concern was someone getting pinned against a cage. Isn’t ONE proving that to be BS? MMA becomes a lot more interesting if we start getting knees and kicks to grounded opponents. More finishes.

 

[FlyingDeathKick]

I think it's far more dangerous that 12-6 elbows.... But yeah for me, if the guy laying on his back is allowed to kick at the head of the dude standing up then the guy standing should be allowed to as well. Either ban both or allow kicks to a downed opponent.