Social Scientists reject veganism: Meat is crucial for human health

[Two Crows]

You're around St Louis, right ?

Yes, unfortunately.

Lol.

 

[Spetsnaz77]

Yes, unfortunately.

Lol.

What part ??

Me too... But there's an incredible south American restaurant in Maplewood called Asador Del Sur. Their seafood is absolutely incredible. I get the 24 oz bone in Ribeye with grilled chimichurri shrimp... Fuuuuuuuck

 

[The Big Yin]

Yay, another omnivore Vs vegan debate.

So is the science catching up to the fact that animal fats are essential to good health? I spent my entire childhood being indoctrinated to eat margarine, high sugar low fat yoghurts and to trim the fat off every piece of meat going.

My grandad used to eat the fat rind from a steak in a Sandwich, and dip it in beef dripping. And he lived a very long life as a complete bastard.

 

[Spetsnaz77]

Yay, another omnivore Vs vegan debate.

So is the science catching up to the fact that animal fats are essential to good health? I spent my entire childhood being indoctrinated to eat margarine, high sugar low fat yoghurts and to trim the fat off every piece of meat going.

My grandad used to eat the fat rind from a steak in a Sandwich, and dip it in beef dripping. And he lived a very long life as a complete bastard.

Nefarious... The push away from meat to vegetables and grains and plant proteins = weak sick populace

 

[Two Crows]

What part ??

Me too... But there's an incredible south American restaurant in Maplewood called Asador Del Sur. Their seafood is absolutely incredible. I get the 24 oz bone in Ribeye with grilled chimichurri shrimp... Fuuuuuuuck

I grew-up in North Co. (Castle Point/Riverview/Calvetron Park, and others), but I live in Dardenne Prairie now. If I get to take the wife out sometime, we might try it out. Uruguay cuisine?

There is a spot in Old St. Charles I've been meaning to get to; Jalea. Apparently they serve Peruvian dishes.

I don't get out much these days, though.

 

[Spetsnaz77]

I grew-up in North Co. (Castle Point/Riverview/Calvetron Park, and others), but I live in Dardenne Prairie now. If I get to take the wife out sometime, we might try it out. Uruguay cuisine?

There is a spot in Old St. Charles I've been meaning to get to; Jalea. Apparently they serve Peruvian dishes.

I don't get out much these days, though.

Nice area bro. Im from St Charles. Live in south city now. Hate it.

Old town St Charles is still really charming. Lived on Main St for years after getting out of the Marines.

 

[A Very Serious Cat]

He’s definitely not the worlds strongest man. Why would you think that?

I also tend to think he’s right; that a mostly vegetarian diet with some meat is the way to go for good health and longevity. However, that dude is clearly in PEDs so don’t think for a second that people are going to replicate his physique with his diet

Not many men you could argue are above him, Dan Bell, Lasha, Thor if he commits to a comeback and a few other strongmen? Not a big list

 

[Deorum]

Meat specifically red meat is a nutritional power house.

The ruminants are king, much better than fowl, swine or water bugs for nutritional value, satiety and taste. Bring The Beef or GTFO. It's also tremendously convenient that real steaks (i.e. ribeyes and short loins) don't require anything but a sprinkle of rock salt, ground pepper and 4 minutes per side on the grill.

 

[rob mafia]

the only thing vegans really lack is b12, which can be easily obtained. cyanocobalamin (most common b12 additive/supplement) is low/zero absorption crap, but methylcobalamin is good.

vegans, omnivores, diet fad of the year, and etc can all be eating well or like shit.

 

[rob mafia]

Well it says he's not vegan but even if he was he's able to cover up deficiencies with unrestricted ped use

tell us you know nothing about this without telling us you know nothing about this.

how the fuck are peds going to "cover up deficiencies?" bruh, if you're not getting complete protein, roids won't make you bulk. and it's not like normal (meat eating) strongmen/bodybuilders don't use supplements, anyway.

 

[ocean size]

the only thing vegans really lack is b12, which can be easily obtained. cyanocobalamin (most common b12 additive/supplement) is low/zero absorption crap, but methylcobalamin is good.

vegans, omnivores, diet fad of the year, and etc can all be eating well or like shit.

And these days most livestock people reading this are consuming need supplements for B12, so taking it yourself is just cutting out a middleman.

That said, there is a point hiding in the headline although it isn't that clear. While it is fully possible to be a healthy vegan, it is easier when well resourced and educated and when you take the time to plan a diet. The 'silent hunger' of micronutrient deficiencies affect way too many people, more than they need to. Meat just happens to be really nutrient dense and a little can go a long way without people going out of their way.

It isn't essential, but there's a point to be made that on a population level, any shift toward less animal products it should be considered. Despite generally having the means to get a balanced diet, a decent proportion of the US population already has Vit D, B6, mineral deficiencies, and in countries that don't have the same fortification of staple foods (and more limited means) the consequences are gnarly, like developmental issues in India due to maternal and childhood deficiencies of folate, B12, iron. Similarly this is why these days the FDA guidelines encourage pregnant women to consume moderate amounts of fish despite presence of mercury, because the benefits of essential fatty acids present for fetal development greatly outweigh the risk for species with moderate mercury loads

 

[A Very Serious Cat]

tell us you know nothing about this without telling us you know nothing about this.

how the fuck are peds going to "cover up deficiencies?" bruh, if you're not getting complete protein, roids won't make you bulk. and it's not like normal (meat eating) strongmen/bodybuilders don't use supplements, anyway.

Because with the amount of gear those guys use him possibly eating less than the optimal amount of meat for his needs is pretty minor compared to the effects of the drugs, which is why I said cover up not make up for deficiencies. The point being using someone like him is not the best person to promote any diet.

Also not sure what you mean by roids won't make you bulk, there is that study that showed simply taking test and sitting on your ass will grow more muscle than working out clean, provided you at least are eating a calorie surplus

 

[Sano]

This topic always makes my head hurt, simliar to the one about dietary cholesterol and heart disaese. There is a lot of confusion out there and people with various agendas.

1. Diets high in vegetables, fruits, fibre/wholegrain and healthy fats - nuts, seeds, seafood consistently show the best outcomes across different populations
2. Red meats are great sources of protein and minerals
3. Red meats do increase the risk of certain cancers and diseases, however that risk is relatively small and mitigated by diet and lifestyle
4. We overconsume meat in the west and still struggle with vitamin and mineral deficiencies
5. You can be healthy on a strict vegan diet, however it is difficult to maintain and not feasible for everyone

 

[Spetsnaz77]

This topic always makes my head hurt, simliar to the one about dietary cholesterol and heart disaese. There is a lot of confusion out there and people with various agendas.

1. Diets high in vegetables, fruits, fibre/wholegrain and healthy fats - nuts, seeds, seafood consistently show the best outcomes across different populations
2. Red meats are great sources of protein and minerals
3. Red meats do increase the risk of certain cancers and diseases, however that risk is relatively small and mitigated by diet and lifestyle
4. We overconsume meat in the west and still struggle with vitamin and mineral deficiencies
5. You can be healthy on a strict vegan diet, however it is difficult to maintain and not feasible for everyone

No

 

[FinalFight]

Vegan Ultra-Runner Wins Zion 100KM Desert Trail Race


Vegan ultra-runner Austin Meyer took first place at the Zion Ultra 100km (62 mile) race on April 15, finishing in just over 10 hours (10:07:53).
https://plantbasednews.org/culture/sport/vegan-ultra-runner-wins-ultramarathon-race-zion/

 

[Andy Capp]

Eat like the Japanese. There's a reason why they live so long on average. Don't think they eat much red meat.

I totally agree with the first sentence, however, ever seen the line up at a MacDonalds in Tokyo at lunch time? I have--they were all the way out the door and down the block. I mean, sure, on average, Japanese people may eat less red meat compared to other sources of protein but it's surely not the only factor nor the most important to longevity, IMHO.

My guess at the main reasons:
Fitness. Kids are engaged in exercise for fitness from the first grade all the way to the last. It sets them up for continued health and fitness throughout their lives.

Kids are also required to attend their school food programs--everyone eats the school lunch--which are also strongly focused on providing complete nutrition in their food choices.

Small dish portions. I think when you eat several small portions you can more easily ensure a sufficiently varied and nutritious moderate diet but you're also better off if you over eat compared to steam-shoveling a 12 oz steak and a slab of mashed potatoes soaked in butter.

High prevalence of soups and other dishes made from seaweed and fish in their diet. Seaweed especially is a wonder food as far as I am concerned.

But at no time have I ever gotten the impression from Japanese people they aren't interested in red meat.

Check this out at my wife's favorite burger chain, https://www.mos.jp/inbound/en/, for about $4 in USD,

100% Japanese beef and pork patty, topped with original domestic cheese and sliced onions, all covered in savory rich "Japanese style soy sauce" made from domestic whole soy beans.

Anyway, just my two cents. I'm sure eating more fish and less red meat is healthful but I guarantee they'd be no better off if they ate giant portions of fish the way North Americans eat steak. To be clear, I love meat. But I also love almost every other kind of food I have ever tasted. Variety is where it's at.

 

[rob mafia]

Because with the amount of gear those guys use him possibly eating less than the optimal amount of meat for his needs is pretty minor compared to the effects of the drugs, which is why I said cover up not make up for deficiencies. The point being using someone like him is not the best person to promote any diet.

Also not sure what you mean by roids won't make you bulk, there is that study that showed simply taking test and sitting on your ass will grow more muscle than working out clean, provided you at least are eating a calorie surplus

gear isn't magic. muscle can't build without (complete) protein.

That said, there is a point hiding in the headline although it isn't that clear. While it is fully possible to be a healthy vegan, it is easier when well resourced and educated and when you take the time to plan a diet.

same as with any diet, vegan or not. that's the/my point.

It isn't essential, but there's a point to be made that on a population level, any shift toward less animal products it should be considered. Despite generally having the means to get a balanced diet, a decent proportion of the US population already has Vit D, B6, mineral deficiencies, and in countries that don't have the same fortification of staple foods (and more limited means) the consequences are gnarly, like developmental issues in India due to maternal and childhood deficiencies of folate, B12, iron. Similarly this is why these days the FDA guidelines encourage pregnant women to consume moderate amounts of fish despite presence of mercury, because the benefits of essential fatty acids present for fetal development greatly outweigh the risk for species with moderate mercury loads

omega-3 ftw

 

[AnGrYcRoW]

Yay, another omnivore Vs vegan debate.

So is the science catching up to the fact that animal fats are essential to good health? I spent my entire childhood being indoctrinated to eat margarine, high sugar low fat yoghurts and to trim the fat off every piece of meat going.

My grandad used to eat the fat rind from a steak in a Sandwich, and dip it in beef dripping. And he lived a very long life as a complete bastard.

What magic compound is in animal fat that is "essential" to good health ?

 

[Eric Silva 2.0]

Most importantly, socializing is healthy for living and we all know that you don't make friends with salad.

Steak and a nice bottle of wine or whiskey!

 

[AnGrYcRoW]

the only thing vegans really lack is b12, which can be easily obtained. cyanocobalamin (most common b12 additive/supplement) is low/zero absorption crap, but methylcobalamin is good.

vegans, omnivores, diet fad of the year, and etc can all be eating well or like shit.

Wow , someone in this thread who has actually educated himself and understands the science.