DC Believes Fedor Was 'Average At Best' In 2009

[Takes_Two_To_Tango]

a quick google search led me to this 2009 top ten in the ufc
1. Brock Lesnar (UFC Heavyweight Champion)
2. Randy Couture
3. Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira
4. Frank Mir
5. Shane Carwin
6. Cain Velasquez
7. Mirko Cro Cop
8. Junior dos Santos
9. Cheick Kongo
10. Heath Herring

come DC. you sound stttttoooooopit

This got me to do my own search. According to Bloody Elbow in March of 2009, these were the rankings for HW.

https://www.bloodyelbow.com/2009/3/25/808201/usat-sbn-march-mma-consens

 

[NoSmilez]

AA wasn’t in the UFC because he left to fight Fedor though. Fedor fought him in January 2009. I think we have to assume that if Fedor came to the UFC in ‘09, Arlovski would’ve stayed and we would’ve seen the fight there.
Gonzaga fought Couture in ‘07, he wasn’t doing so hot by ‘09.

lol you are right. I didn't even remember 09 was the year he fought AA. It is a giant clusterfuck. Werdum was in the UFC in 08 and got cut when JDS knocked him out. There must be some ranked guys we forgot or we can't have a top ten in the UFC. It was a weird time I think Brett Rogers was ranked close to top 5 worldwide or even breaking it since he did beat AA few months after Fedor.

 

[Takes_Two_To_Tango]

Here's December of 2009 HW rankings by Bloody Elbow.

https://www.bloodyelbow.com/2009/12/16/1200998/usat-sbn-december-mma-consensus

 

[textwarrior]

https://www.mmafighting.com/2021/10...verage-at-best-had-he-come-to-the-ufc-in-2009


“Versus Brock Lesnar, I’ll give you that. I think he beats Brock Lesnar. But outside of that, I don’t think Fedor competes very well in the UFC. I think that, honestly, Fedor not going to the UFC allowed for the intrigue to stay, but the reality of the situation is he would not have done well against those guys like JDS (Junior dos Santos), he wasn’t beating Cain Velasquez, he would have struggled with guys like Cheick Kongo. He was not beating those guys that were at the top of the UFC at that time. I’m certain of it.

“I know you’re gonna say, ‘ Well he beat this guy, he beat (Antonio Rodrigo) Nogueira and he beat Frank Mir.’ For as great as he is, he would have been, at that time in the sport, average at best. I’m telling you. Fedor Emelianenko in the UFC between 2009-11, average at best.”

Do you agree?

I think Fedor lost his prime shape and ability at around that time. He was kind of small for that weight class too. When he left Pride he started to decline. But, DC, is making Dana smile when he says that.

 

[Area809]

I respect Cormier but I don't get how he can say Fedor would have been average when he beat Frank Mir, a former 2x UFC champion and Nog also being a UFC champ. That alone puts him above average.

Perhaps because Fedor was in fact average from 2009-2011.

 

[nostradumbass]

He mentioned specifically Cain and jds. I don’t think it’s too crazy to suggest those guys would beat fedor. Aa and Sylvia weren’t in the ufc. And he beat mir after mir had lost 6 of 8. Not 2009 mir.

Brock Lesnar was champ from late 2008 to the end of 2010. Tim Sylvia just fought for an interim UFC title 1 fight before Fedor, and he lost to a guy that Fedor also beat twice and Arlovski was on maybe the best win streak of his career.

Fedor is 3 years older than Mir with 13 more fights than Mir, so how does that matchup happening later benefit Fedor?

 

[Stump]

Tend to agree. I think DC is putting it a bit more emphatically than I would, but I think Fedor probably had a ten year prime. I feel like he had slowed down quite a bit by 2009, 2010. As the greatest of all time, even slowed down he was a killer, but he wasn't the machine he used to be.

that said, I think "average at best" is pretty silly. He'd have been elite, but maybe not the champ if he had come to the UFC in 2009.

Also, I'm not sure Brock Lesnar is less of a threat than Bigfoot was, and Bigfoot got the win in 2011. I'd loved to have seen Fedor vs. Brock. Fedor almost certainly woulf have lit him up with hooks but Brock was a massive, strong dude who could wrestle.

 

[kflo]

lol you are right. I didn't even remember 09 was the year he fought AA. It is a giant clusterfuck. Werdum was in the UFC in 08 and got cut when JDS knocked him out. There must be some ranked guys we forgot or we can't have a top ten in the UFC. It was a weird time I think Brett Rogers was ranked close to top 5 worldwide or even breaking it since he did beat AA few months after Fedor.

you guys are all overthinking this. he explicitly mentioned cain and jds. and obviously that's true. kongo likely wasn't an easy fight for fedor (he's not an easy fight for most fighters). fedor lost 3 straight in that time. he wasn't in his prime.

was dc being a bit hyperbolic? yes. but the point of fedor having trouble with the very best fighters is obviously true.

 

[NoSmilez]

This got me to do my own search. According to Bloody Elbow in March of 2009, these were the rankings for HW.

https://www.bloodyelbow.com/2009/3/25/808201/usat-sbn-march-mma-consens

View attachment 886124

The issue with that is the list drastically changes depending on the quarter of the year. Brock killed Mir later that year. 2010 was the beginning of the culling of the old guard and the new ones becoming the standard.

 

[kflo]

Brock Lesnar was champ from late 2008 to the end of 2010.

Fedor is 3 years older than Mir with 13 more fights than Mir, so how does that matchup happening later benefit Fedor?

not sure what point you're making on brock. dc said cain and jds would be bad matchups for fedor. that's true. unquestionably.

and c'mon. again, mir had lost 6 of 8 BEFORE fighting fedor. surely you can see he wasn't the same fighter he was in 2009.......i mean fedor is older than rampage too. that doesn't mean there's anything to take away from their fight.

 

[NoSmilez]

you guys are all overthinking this. he explicitly mentioned cain and jds. and obviously that's true. kongo likely wasn't an easy fight for fedor (he's not an easy fight for most fighters). fedor lost 3 straight in that time. he wasn't in his prime.

was dc being a bit hyperbolic? yes. but the point of fedor having trouble with the very best fighters is obviously true.

I agree that Cain and JDS scalps Fedor. They were bigger guys who knew how to do a little bit of everything as opposed to being one dimensional.

 

[Takes_Two_To_Tango]

The issue with that is the list drastically changes depending on the quarter of the year. Brock killed Mir later that year. 2010 was the beginning of the culling of the old guard and the new ones becoming the standard.

Here's another one December of 2009. Where you have Fedor and Brock ranked 1 & 2.

Here's December of 2009 HW rankings by Bloody Elbow.

https://www.bloodyelbow.com/2009/12/16/1200998/usat-sbn-december-mma-consensus

View attachment 886125

 

[NoSmilez]

Here's another one December of 2009. Where you have Fedor and Brock ranked 1 & 2.

JDS and Cain were top 5 in the UFC and Shane being the outside 6 in the UFC. Those guys were top 3 in the UFC by 2010. Those aren't easy fights for Fedor.

 

[Icecreamguy]

Fedor on his best day would beat any other man on their best day, except maybe k1 overeem.

 

[jeskola]

https://www.mmafighting.com/2021/10...verage-at-best-had-he-come-to-the-ufc-in-2009


“Versus Brock Lesnar, I’ll give you that. I think he beats Brock Lesnar. But outside of that, I don’t think Fedor competes very well in the UFC. I think that, honestly, Fedor not going to the UFC allowed for the intrigue to stay, but the reality of the situation is he would not have done well against those guys like JDS (Junior dos Santos), he wasn’t beating Cain Velasquez, he would have struggled with guys like Cheick Kongo. He was not beating those guys that were at the top of the UFC at that time. I’m certain of it.

“I know you’re gonna say, ‘ Well he beat this guy, he beat (Antonio Rodrigo) Nogueira and he beat Frank Mir.’ For as great as he is, he would have been, at that time in the sport, average at best. I’m telling you. Fedor Emelianenko in the UFC between 2009-11, average at best.”

Do you agree?

Amen. I've been saying this on the forums since 2009. Anyone who disagrees is a biased, rose-colored-glasses fool.

 

[Superior]

Fedor would ko DC and Cain in the same night.

 

[COBRA03]

I agree with DC 100%. From 2009-2011, Fedor beat Arlovski and Brett Rogers, then was finished 3 times in a row by Werdum, Bigfoot Silva, and Dan Henderson. Finnished 2011 with 2 ho-hum wins against Jeff Monson and Ishii. I would say that is below average.

 

[TheBiggestLittleTinyMan]

https://www.mmafighting.com/2021/10...verage-at-best-had-he-come-to-the-ufc-in-2009


“Versus Brock Lesnar, I’ll give you that. I think he beats Brock Lesnar. But outside of that, I don’t think Fedor competes very well in the UFC. I think that, honestly, Fedor not going to the UFC allowed for the intrigue to stay, but the reality of the situation is he would not have done well against those guys like JDS (Junior dos Santos), he wasn’t beating Cain Velasquez, he would have struggled with guys like Cheick Kongo. He was not beating those guys that were at the top of the UFC at that time. I’m certain of it.

“I know you’re gonna say, ‘ Well he beat this guy, he beat (Antonio Rodrigo) Nogueira and he beat Frank Mir.’ For as great as he is, he would have been, at that time in the sport, average at best. I’m telling you. Fedor Emelianenko in the UFC between 2009-11, average at best.”

Do you agree?

Seems paradoxical to say, "He would beat the champ, but otherwise would be average at best". Fedor certainly wasn't in top form at that time, but it's a little harsh to say "struggles with Cheik Kongo" is average at best. I seem to recall DC's friend Cain struggling with a guy like Cheik Kongo in 2009.

 

[WhiteMousse]

Shut the fuck up DC

 

[Pain4Pain]

IIRC Fedor's trainer mentioned Fedor stopped doing most of his S&C and would just drill technique, sparred less as well. His physique did get more pudgy and his reflexes declined in the late 2000s.
Fedor admits to losing the will to train as well.

I guess all that money and fame deprives fighters of their hunger to be great.