International Hamas launches surprise attack on Israel; Israel has declared a state of war. Vol. VII

[Anewt]

that doesn't say the guy personally saw israeli tanks fire rounds.

and c'mon - the unrwa is a palestinian body far more than a UN body. they are made up of like 99% palestinians.

The guys employment history speaks for itself. I don't view him as Palestinian. Nor does being Palestinian mean its a lie anyhow.

What are you arguing btw. That it could be hamas?.... yes. It could and if it is its hamas its also a warcrime and should be prosecuted as such.

If its the idf is it a warcrime and should it be prosecuted as such?

We agree ?

 

[Siver!]

So you gonna reveal how you know this was the result of intentional IDF fire on known UN location yet?

"BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT"

Genuine question: do you feel ashamed of yourself?

This one alleged incident sits alongside proven and admitted incidents, so really, your focus should be on those.

 

[kflo]

No, bud, they have to have watertight intelligence as they're being monitored very closely despite all attempts to shut down communication channels in and out of Gaza.

They're not mistakes when they're intentionally gunning down civilians waving white flags or blowing up journalists or attacking fleeing citizens in safe zones. A mistake is aiming for someone else and hitting the wrong target. Shooting people with white flags in cold blood =/= a mistake.

These are war crimes, call them what they are.

If a soldier has an itchy trigger finger and fires incorrectly, what does that mean for the war effort?

If you want to charge him, ok? Then what?

 

[kflo]

The guys employment history speaks for itself. I don't view him as Palestinian. Nor does being Palestinian mean its a lie anyhow.

I didn’t say it’s a lie. I said he likely didn’t see it and didn’t claim to.

What are you arguing btw. That it could be hamas?.... yes. It could and if it is its hamas its also a warcrime and should be prosecuted as such.

If its the idf is it a warcrime and should it be prosecuted as such?

We agree ?

If we have all the facts and it’s clear there was a war crime then sure. Then what?

 

[Siver!]

If a soldier has an itchy trigger finger and fires incorrectly, what does that mean for the war effort?

If you want to charge him, ok? Then what?

Charge him and his commanding officer. The IDF should consider referring themselves to an international court for arbitration for repeated violations of international law and war crimes.

But not only in the instances where they are forced to admit it - they should be doing better full stop, they're supposedly the responsible party, but it's no coincidence they keep getting caught committing war crimes when the death toll is ungodly high for a conflict over such a short space of time.

They should consider if their tactics are working at all, and reprimand themselves for killing so many people.

 

[kflo]

Charge him and his commanding officer. The IDF should consider referring themselves to an international court for arbitration for repeated violations of international law and war crimes.

But not only in the instances where they are forced to admit it - they should be doing better full stop, they're supposedly the responsible party, but it's no coincidence they keep getting caught committing war crimes when the death toll is ungodly high for a conflict over such a short space of time.

They should consider if their tactics are working at all, and reprimand themselves for killing so many people.

Has nothing to do with fighting an enemy that follows no rules of war. None. Fights among civilians in civilian spaces dressed as civilians. I have no doubt they’ve been fired upon or attacked under guise of white flags. Do you think hamas is above that?

 

[Siver!]

Has nothing to do with fighting an enemy that follows no rules of war. None. Fights among civilians in civilian spaces dressed as civilians. I have no doubt they’ve been fired upon or attacked under guise of white flags. Do you think hamas is above that?

No, nor is it an excuse.

Sorry, war crimes are war crimes no matter which side are guilty. It's sad you can only see this conflict as being unacceptable on one side when it is very clearly not.

 

[Rational Poster]

"BUT BUT BUT BUT BUT"

Genuine question: do you feel ashamed of yourself?

This one alleged incident sits alongside proven and admitted incidents, so really, your focus should be on those.

So you can't and you just want to assume?

 

[Siver!]

So you can't and you just want to assume?

Don't need to bud, I can easily look at the proven and admitted war crimes while you focus on 1 specific event because you can't do anything else in your irrational defence of the IDF's performance in Gaza.

 

[Rational Poster]

Don't need to bud, I can easily look at the proven and admitted war crimes while you focus on 1 specific event because you can't do anything else in your irrational defence of the IDF's performance in Gaza.

But Hamas being known to use hospitals, ambulances, UN facilities, schools and other civilian infrastructure to launch their attacks while wearing civilian clothing doesn't factor into that calculus at all?

 

[kflo]

No, nor is it an excuse.

Sorry, war crimes are war crimes no matter which side are guilty. It's sad you can only see this conflict as being unacceptable on one side when it is very clearly not.

Sorry but you’re wrong. When your enemy does those things THEY are intentionally putting their people in harms way and THEY bear accountability for doing so. They don’t get added protection from their war crimes.

The IDF obviously has accountability for their actions but Hamas war crimes are continuous and egregious and they intentionally sacrifice their people because it benefits their cause. And adds protection to them.

 

[Siver!]

But Hamas being known to use hospitals, ambulances, UN facilities, schools and other civilian infrastructure to launch their attacks while wearing civilian clothing doesn't factor into that calculus at all?

Just had this discussion with @kflo, feel free to read my responses there

 

[Siver!]

The IDF obviously has accountability for their actions

Strong admission.

Well done!

 

[kflo]

But Hamas being known to use hospitals, ambulances, UN facilities, schools and other civilian infrastructure to launch their attacks while wearing civilian clothing doesn't factor into that calculus at all?

Apparently that gives them immunity….

 

[Siver!]

Apparently that gives them immunity….

The opposite of giving the IDF carte blanche to murder anyone under any circumstances is "Hamas must be kept immune" to you.

That is where your faulty logic has brought you...

Dear oh dear...

 

[kflo]

The opposite of giving the IDF carte blanche to murder anyone under any circumstances is "Hamas must be kept immune" to you.

That is where your faulty logic has brought you...

Dear oh dear...

They don’t have carte blanche. But they are fighting a ruthless enemy who follows no rules of war and commits war crimes every minute, by default.

 

[Rational Poster]

Just had this discussion with @kflo, feel free to read my responses there

"I am going to assume the worst on a breaking story from a non-vetted source because I'm biased"

That seems to be all you've said so far.

 

[Siver!]

"I am going to assume the worst on a breaking story from a non-vetted source because I'm biased"

That seems to be all you've said so far.

You're applying too much focus on the breaking story.

You realize I have not been focusing on the breaking story much at all, right?

 

[Rational Poster]

You're applying too much focus on the breaking story.

You realize I have not been focusing on the breaking story much at all, right?

I mean I get that you want to talk about anything else but the post I originally quoted you on because it's obvious to everyone and even yourself you're not sure of the details and are too entrenched to just admit that.

 

[Chad R. Thundercock]

Not even top ten

I don't know whether I should take this as an insult or a compliment. Am I at least in the top 20 of the worst posters?