Elections Sweden Election 2022 - A brighter future

[Hellowhosthat]

LOL

You don't seem to want to understand reality.

Just like the white moths that were wiped out by hungry birds during the worst of industrialization in England. The white birch trees that the moths sought out and with which they could camouflage suddenly turned black from the pollution. The moths did not have time to adjust and change body color.

Likewise, I have the belief that surroundings clearly influence people. With enough time, this conditioned behavior becomes so noticeable that it makes possible the restructuring of the DNA when the influence becomes so noticeable that a change must take place for one's survival.

Since my earlier days, all my coaches have always talked about the southern temperament. My opponents in the ring who have come from hot areas like MENA have always had a natural aggression. You yourself have said that the Swedes are pussies.

No matter how much you oppose this, it is something that is talked about and I have experienced it myself through fights in boxing and MT against even-tempered boys, and older men who talk loudly and with their whole body to get their message across.

I'm no scientist but I'm fairly sure that's not how DNA works.

 

[SanchoMF]

I never said you did claim that but your buddy theBloB here is, do you think its weird that maybe some people might think those kinds of posts by him are a bit racist and far right? You seemed annoyed that anyone might dare call him a Nazi despite the fact that he's pushing social Darwinist talking points.

I am actually annoyed when people pull out the Nazi card and use it even in a more figurative way in today's context. There aren't any nazies here or pretty much nowhere else either.

Anyway, to 'social darwinism' :
I did scroll up to read his comment, to which I think you might be referring to here.

I think that we have to acknowledge that evolutionary biology and behavioural genetics are real 'things', so the aggression gene is passed through reproduction, while simultaneously altering the human genome in the longer run (call it natural selection or whatever).
Let's consider that people with certain serotonin-processing capabilities (or fucking VNTR 2R, MAO-A what have you) are reproducing within a relatively small group, like a small ethnic enclave, with both parents passing on the attributes to the next generation.

Is there a possibility that during the past 5 generations the Swedish folks (isolated until relatively recently) have genetically become less prone to aggression, because there's no need for this harmful attribute in the conditions they live?
Let's consider that, while factoring in that the 'other reference group' in our context are coming from unstable and much less-developed countries (asylum seekers, refugees from the 3rd world), with a relatively recent arrival to very isolated communities in Sweden, while mostly reproducing within the community.
Very plausible, needs further study.

I think I need to point out that I don't consider this racial, but something genetic and cultural.

 

[theBloB]

I'm no scientist but I'm fairly sure that's not how DNA works.

I'm like you, don't know how the complexity works. But I am pretty sure that behavior is something that is inherited.

Some people have a way of dealing with situations differently. We normal Swedes do it through dialogue or use our legal system to clarify ambiguities. The MENSA muslims in our country solve it by a bullet in the head or by the richest strongman family serving justice through mediation and penalty payment without the involvement of the Swedish judiciary. We simply have people who have a different mindset and behavior than the average Swede and we have very bad experience with this MENA group. It is just to state without being accused of racism that some human groups cannot live with others. We think completely differently to make it work. Sweden is not in the same situation as the United States, where our country needs untrained labor as our jobs require training. MENA would certainly have been better for the US and you are most welcome to take the ones we have.

 

[Hellowhosthat]

I'm like you, don't know how the complexity works. But I am pretty sure that behavior is something that is inherited.

Some people have a way of dealing with situations differently. We normal Swedes do it through dialogue or use our legal system to clarify ambiguities. The MENSA muslims in our country solve it by a bullet in the head or by the richest strongman family serving justice through mediation and penalty payment without the involvement of the Swedish judiciary. We simply have people who have a different mindset and behavior than the average Swede and we have very bad experience with this MENA group. It is just to state without being accused of racism that some human groups cannot live with others. We think completely differently to make it work. Sweden is not in the same situation as the United States, where our country needs untrained labor as our jobs require training. MENA would certainly have been better for the US and you are most welcome to take the ones we have.

It's not DNA, surroundings and culture maybe. If the same kid is born in a completely different situation he likely won't act the same.

 

[theBloB]

It's not DNA, surroundings and culture maybe. If the same kid is born in a completely different situation he likely won't act the same.

Are u sure about that?

In my family we have 3 adopted children from South Korea. They arrived when they were between 20 months and 2 years old. They were brought up by all-Swedish parents. But they have something that is unique. In addition to always wanting to prove themselves to the outside world just because they have black hair, they are incredibly proud, hate to lose face, very determined. These characteristics were further confirmed after a few visits to their former homeland.

 

[Islam Imamate]

We can sit down and have an exchange on the day you are prepared to listen and not draw your preconceived notions. Because that's exactly what you do. In a dialog with an entry point, if you just attack, it doesn't lead to anything at all. Stop playing the victim is a good start.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. You are clearly a well-read man and certainly have a lot of theoretical background, but you don't have much experience with the bitter side of life at ground level.

That's rich coming from you when you assume I'm some traitor to my nation solely for my faith, that's the textbook definition of a preconceived notion.

I am actually annoyed when people pull out the Nazi card and use it even in a more figurative way in today's context. There aren't any nazies here or pretty much nowhere else either.

Anyway, to 'social darwinism' :
I did scroll up to read his comment, to which I think you might be referring to here.

I think that we have to acknowledge that evolutionary biology and behavioural genetics are real 'things', so the aggression gene is passed through reproduction, while simultaneously altering the human genome in the longer run (call it natural selection or whatever).
Let's consider that people with certain serotonin-processing capabilities (or fucking VNTR 2R, MAO-A what have you) are reproducing within a relatively small group, like a small ethnic enclave, with both parents passing on the attributes to the next generation.

Is there a possibility that during the past 5 generations the Swedish folks (isolated until relatively recently) have genetically become less prone to aggression, because there's no need for this harmful attribute in the conditions they live?
Let's consider that, while factoring in that the 'other reference group' in our context are coming from unstable and much less-developed countries (asylum seekers, refugees from the 3rd world), with a relatively recent arrival to very isolated communities in Sweden, while mostly reproducing within the community.
Very plausible, needs further study.

I think I need to point out that I don't consider this racial, but something genetic and cultural.

"There are absolutely and definitively no Nazis anymore anywhere but also, let's consider the possibility that MENA immigrants are genetically more violent"

Are you really blind to how that comes off? You guys are so stuck in your little echo chamber here that you're engaging in social Darwinist and eugenics talking points all the while clutching your pearls at accusation of bigotry. Really didn't think you'd let the mask fall off like that but was bound to happen eventually.

 

[theBloB]

That's rich coming from you when you assume I'm some traitor to my nation solely for my faith, that's the textbook definition of a preconceived notion.

"There are absolutely and definitively no Nazis anymore anywhere but also, let's consider the possibility that MENA immigrants are genetically more violent"

Are you really blind to how that comes off? You guys are so stuck in your little echo chamber here that you're engaging in social Darwinist and eugenics talking points all the while clutching your pearls at accusation of bigotry. Really didn't think you'd let the mask fall off like that but was bound to happen eventually.

Act like a mod and stop being so queer.

 

[Hellowhosthat]

Are u sure about that?

In my family we have 3 adopted children from South Korea. They arrived when they were between 20 months and 2 years old. They were brought up by all-Swedish parents. But they have something that is unique. In addition to always wanting to prove themselves to the outside world just because they have black hair, they are incredibly proud, hate to lose face, very determined. These characteristics were further confirmed after a few visits to their former homeland.

Well it would depend on whether they were treated any differently or not. If they were expected to have those traits then perhaps they were brought up in that way.

 

[theBloB]

Well it would depend on whether they were treated any differently or not. If they were expected to have those traits then perhaps they were brought up in that way.

The question is that. How can you be sure that behavior cannot be in DNA.

To take another example, Sweden is a country that adopts a lot.

I have an Indian male colleague who is like all other Swedes and speaks perfect Swedish. He came as a baby but grew up with 2 female parents most of the time. However, he has a peculiarity that is joked about at work.

He makes head wobbles without being aware of it.

 

[Hellowhosthat]

The question is that. How can you be sure that behavior cannot be in DNA.

To take another example, Sweden is a country that adopts a lot.

I have an Indian male colleague who is like all other Swedes and speaks perfect Swedish. He came as a baby but grew up with 2 female parents most of the time. However, he has a peculiarity that is joked about at work.

He makes head wobbles without being aware of it.

Is India known as a head wobbling society? Perhaps he has some ancestors who lives on car dashboards?

 

[Ornife]

I'm like you, don't know how the complexity works. But I am pretty sure that behavior is something that is inherited.

Some people have a way of dealing with situations differently. We normal Swedes do it through dialogue or use our legal system to clarify ambiguities. The MENSA muslims in our country solve it by a bullet in the head or by the richest strongman family serving justice through mediation and penalty payment without the involvement of the Swedish judiciary. We simply have people who have a different mindset and behavior than the average Swede and we have very bad experience with this MENA group. It is just to state without being accused of racism that some human groups cannot live with others. We think completely differently to make it work. Sweden is not in the same situation as the United States, where our country needs untrained labor as our jobs require training. MENA would certainly have been better for the US and you are most welcome to take the ones we have.

This is the exact type of thinking that led other people around the globe to have their native culture stolen and destroyed because of colonial paternalism.

You want to preserve your culture which is laudable, but then you start mixing in ideas of racial hierarchy and immediately lose me and any other reasonable person reading this thread. The mentality you espoused in your post is the reason children were put into residential schools or the potlach was banned.

This place always take things too fucking far.

 

[theBloB]

Is India known as a head wobbling society? Perhaps he has some ancestors who lives on car dashboards?

The point is. Don't discount the idea that behaviors can actually be hereditary and in our DNA. Therefore, I believe that certain groups that have lived close and isolated tend to force behaviors into the DNA.

But what do I know. I've heard something about isolation and blond hair in whites if we're talking about physical traits.

 

[Hellowhosthat]

The point is. Don't discount the idea that behaviors can actually be hereditary and in our DNA. Therefore, I believe that certain groups that have lived close and isolated tend to force behaviors into the DNA.

But what do I know. I've heard something about isolation and blond hair in whites if we're talking about physical traits.

I think behaviours can be in DNA, ie psychopathic traits etc. But I think the idea of people from a certain area having similar DNA behaviour wise is silly. Otherwise people would act much more similarly than they do.

 

[SanchoMF]

"There are absolutely and definitively no Nazis anymore anywhere but also, let's consider the possibility that MENA immigrants are genetically more violent"

Are you really blind to how that comes off? You guys are so stuck in your little echo chamber here that you're engaging in social Darwinist and eugenics talking points all the while clutching your pearls at accusation of bigotry. Really didn't think you'd let the mask fall off like that but was bound to happen eventually.

Yeah, no nazi-stuff please the word will lose its meaning like that.

Nothing I wrote is offensive :
1. We have to consider that aggression (and the tendency to to act violently) is passed genetically
2. We're talking about the majority and minority of a population that have lived generations in very different conditions in culturally
3. A minority that lives and reproduces in isolation, in conditions that remain different from the 'norm' (higher likelihood and occurrence)

Nothing I said was untrue and it's not about eugenics but I did say that there's probably a rational explanation why certain people can be more prone to violence. There's already a big difference between the Northern Europeans and the Eastern Europeans and really big differences between continents.
We can't really change it. EDIT : And everything obviously varies from person to person, never would I say "all XX are like this". That's not how it works.

I know that usually we're just debating on a much vaguer, conceptual level, but this is essentially an important part of it and should explain 'why' certain things may occur.
I know that this isn't the angle that is commonly brought up, because it starts to raise some hairs but really, should it just be ignored?

 

[theBloB]

This is the exact type of thinking that led other people around the globe to have their native culture stolen and destroyed because of colonial paternalism.

You want to preserve your culture which is laudable, but then you start mixing in ideas of racial hierarchy and immediately lose me and any other reasonable person reading this thread. The mentality you espoused in your post is the reason children were put into residential schools or the potlach was banned.

This place always take things too fucking far.

Sorry I didn't make it more clear. It's all about behaviors that are culturally incompatible with ours in Sweden.

When I talk about strongman culture, I'm talking about the Palestinian or other clan cultures that lives in its own society in Sweden where you don't want anything to do with my country other than living on welfare. This form of extreme masculine culture is totally opposite to the Swedish feminine culture. Geert Hofstede, who was a Dutch anthropologist, showed through his cultural dimension that Sweden was the country in the world that was most distant from MENA countries.

Again, I apologize if you thought this was based on skin color, but it is simply about thoughts and behaviors. And you should be used to it as the verbiage between thoughts exchanged between Democrats and Republicans tends to be very hateful.

 

[SanchoMF]

Jag är så jävla trött på att vi svenskar blir beskrivna som tafatta kukar av den del av den förnuftiga världen.

Visar man då lite kurage och öppnar käften och säger att det får vara nog så kan man räkna med efterföljder.

Istället avreagerar vi oss med nära och kära som alla andra då det är opassande på arbetet. Därför är jag och alla andra skenheliga som attan då vi egentligen borde prata om det i det öppna. Hur skall man då kunna angripa problemen när vår snällkultur bara skjuter fram och skapar en större oreda för våra barn?

En miserabel situation vi är i. Vi har haft funderingar om att flytta till Kanada. Som du kanske kommer ihåg så är min fru av annan etnisk bakgrund och vi har 2 otroligt vackra mixbarn.

Ja, jag förstår vad du menar.
Men låt oss tänka på att ditt senaste val kan komma att börja pendeln äntligen att svänga tillbaka, liknande din granne i söder..

 

[Islam Imamate]

Yeah, no nazi-stuff please the word will lose its meaning like that.

Nothing I wrote is offensive :
1. We have to consider that aggression (and the tendency to to act violently) is passed genetically
2. We're talking about the majority and minority of a population that have lived generations in very different conditions in culturally
3. A minority that lives and reproduces in isolation, in conditions that remain different from the 'norm' (higher likelihood and occurrence)

Nothing I said was untrue and it's not about eugenics but I did say that there's probably a rational explanation why certain people can be more prone to violence. There's already a big difference between the Northern Europeans and the Eastern Europeans and really big differences between continents.
We can't really change it.

I know that usually we're just debating on a much vaguer, conceptual level, but this is essentially an important part of it and should explain 'why' certain things may occur.
I know that this isn't the angle that is commonly brought up, because it starts to raise some hairs but really, should it just be ignored?

You're free to engage with social Darwinist ideas and speculate on MENA immigrants being genetically inferior but my point is that when you couple that with calls to expel people based on their religion and country of origin like TS is then don't be surprised if people think that's coming from a place of bigotry. Should I just ignore where all the signs are pointing to? I could for the sake of good faith conversation but why would I when people like TS are aggressively bad faith and antagonistic towards me because of my faith which, if anything, just kind of further suggest its all based in bigotry.

 

[theBloB]

Yeah, no nazi-stuff please the word will lose its meaning like that.

Nothing I wrote is offensive :
1. We have to consider that aggression (and the tendency to to act violently) is passed genetically
2. We're talking about the majority and minority of a population that have lived generations in very different conditions in culturally
3. A minority that lives and reproduces in isolation, in conditions that remain different from the 'norm' (higher likelihood and occurrence)

Nothing I said was untrue and it's not about eugenics but I did say that there's probably a rational explanation why certain people can be more prone to violence. There's already a big difference between the Northern Europeans and the Eastern Europeans and really big differences between continents.
We can't really change it. EDIT : And everything obviously varies from person to person, never would I say "all XX are like this". That's not how it works.

I know that usually we're just debating on a much vaguer, conceptual level, but this is essentially an important part of it and should explain 'why' certain things may occur.
I know that this isn't the angle that is commonly brought up, because it starts to raise some hairs but really, should it just be ignored?

Some things are apparently not allowed to be discussed here.

I don't understand how people who are so ideologically stuck can't engage in a reasonable debate without attacking someone for racism.

Why can't sensitive issues be discussed? What comes next, questioning ideology or way of life is also racism? Political and social racism?

I have noticed in the threads that discussing blacks in USA due to a higher percentage in crime or murder is unethical and almost forbidden.

The demographic change in Sweden in the last 30 years has been radical. Then it is of course very important to keep an eye on how it affects society, otherwise you don't know how to curb and mitigate problems that arise.

 

[theBloB]

Ja, jag förstår vad du menar.
Men låt oss tänka på att ditt senaste val kan komma att börja pendeln äntligen att svänga tillbaka, liknande din granne i söder..

Ta hand om dig!

Väldigt glad att du delar med dig av tankar i denna tråd. Du berikar den!

Du får vänta med likes, hehe

 

[The_Renaissance]

It's not about inferiority or superiority but it's silly to think that certain groups or nationalities DON'T have behaviour traits that might not translate well outside of their own societal norms.

For example, I'm hoping to go hiking in the Stans next year. It's well known that in, for example, Kyrgyzstan, "wife napping" is a cultural norm outside of major cities/destinations. Its accepted that men will kidnap a woman and force her into marriage.

That sort of mindset is not gonna translate well to somewhere like bloody Sweden or whatever.

There's countries like Papua New Guinea where disputes are regularly settled through murder, mainly among tribesmen.

Is that attitude gonna translate to the west if those lads moved there? Should it be tolerated just because that's "how it is" back home?

On a similar note, if a community of boozey Europeans moved to say, Oman or Iran or something, should they be allowed to get publicly drunk and argue etc in a dry, Muslim country because "that's how it is back home?"

Bad behaviour should never be tolerated and it can be very difficult to expect some people to try and adapt.