Law DeSantis promises to control Disney

[Jack V Savage]

I wouldn't say that bill prevents the acknowledging of gay people. As the father of a 5 year old I am curious as to why she would have to be exposed to LGBTQ+ issues at all in the classroom outside of someone having 2 moms, 2 dads, etc., or, a teacher for some odd reason needing to expose that they have a same sex significant other.

That's the sort of exposure that is being targeted, no? If it were confined to actually bad stuff, there wouldn't be any argument about it.

yes, changes are 100% occurring because of their stance with the governor. But it seems more to me that previously held advantages are being scaled back and they are being treated like other similar private businesses as opposed to being a special class. Floridians have no obligation so subsidize a company that directly and implicitly opposes the citizens viewpoints more than what they are legally owed like every other business.

I think that's the standard rightist viewpoint (that the gov't has a legitimate interest in shutting down speech that conflicts with what the gov't wants). But a lot of rightists have been denying that and acting as if they are actually liberal on the issue of freedom of speech. So people are pointing out that there is a big conflict between that stated position and support for what DeSantis has been doing. A little off topic here, but the rightist establishment has been pushing RDS really hard, and I think the base is starting to spit it out. Wouldn't shock me to see a move to a different Trump alternative.

 

[Jballer]

Probably helped get them into the state. This has been a long standing thing. My guess is that, decades ago or whenever this happened, it was a bit like places bidding for the big Amazon expansion a few years ago - states wanted to have a massive megacorporation set up shop in their state because of the jobs, tourism (in Disney's case) the prestige, etc. Florida probably told Disney "You come to our state and you're in charge of your own land" as part of the pitch.

That’s not how it happened at all. In fact Disney kept their move to Florida secret. They created a bunch of fake shell corporations that had no apparent connection Disney to buy up the land in pieces in order to keep the costs down, because if the state/sellers knew Disney was buying land to create a new theme park, asking prices would’ve skyrocketed.

The reason they were given control of their own land was to lower the tax burden on local municipalities and to speed up construction in order to start generating tourism income for the state as soon as possible. And that was all negotiated after they’d already secured the land.

 

[Poatan Power]

That's the sort of exposure that is being targeted, no? If it were confined to actually bad stuff, there wouldn't be any argument about it.

I disagree that there wouldn't be argument about it. Crossdresser reading books to kids, as an example? lol. In my estimation there seems to be a push to normalize the abnormal, or uncommon, especially when kids are separated from their parents. I think it's great that FLA subsidizes parents choosing schools for their kids in that regard.

From a personal anecdote: my 5 year old was at the gym daycare. she doesn't need a sitter, those are for 3 and under. The gym sitter is a young 20's trans man (biological female). While my 5 year old played with her friend, they were pretending to be mermaids. They asked the sitter to be a mermaid with them. The trans man, with tits and a vag, long hair, obviously visually a biological female, had to tell my 5 year old "I'm a merman. Not a mermaid. I'm not a female." My 5 year old asked what a female was. The sitter took it upon herself to educate my 5 year old, as I walked in on her explaining why she was a merman and not a mermaid even though they had the same "body parts" but she was really a man. I lost my shit (nicely). The young 'man' explained why the conversation occurred and I let them know I don't want their help explaining gender differences to my child who barely isn't a toddler and that shouldn't be an expectation of their presence in the gym daycare. He was super offended that I didn't want him explaining their gender to my child. When I spoke to the gym owner they apologized but cited that the young man called me "transphobic." It just seems wild to me that someone would initiate that conversation with a 5 year old, which, apparently Floridians agree with me in context to school. THAT is exactly what I don't want 5 year olds to go through, especially mine. For the record, when my daughter asks if we can pretend to be mermaids, I just say okay. I don't feel a need to explain the differences in gender to a 5 year old over mermaidism. I find it creepy and weird. I probably won't be wearing a seashell bra, though, lol.

I think that's the standard rightist viewpoint (that the gov't has a legitimate interest in shutting down speech that conflicts with what the gov't wants). But a lot of rightists have been denying that and acting as if they are actually liberal on the issue of freedom of speech. So people are pointing out that there is a big conflict between that stated position and support for what DeSantis has been doing. A little off topic here, but the rightist establishment has been pushing RDS really hard, and I think the base is starting to spit it out. Wouldn't shock me to see a move to a different Trump alternative.

I think businesses should be treated equally. I think Disney, due to its economic influence, has a lot of lateral mobility in positioning. If they're going to deal in matters of propaganda and false narratives they run the risk of politicians returning them to earth on benefits so that they're no different than anyone else.

 

[koquerelle]

In 2023 progressives are pro war, pro big pharma, pro big corps, pro censorship, and anti union.
Trump broke these people.

I don't think you're entirely wrong. We have way too much confidence in big pharma and Biden did fuck the train workers.

That being said, many Republicans would like the world to do nothing about the conflict in Ukraine and think Putin is a great leader. Supporting Ukraine is not about being pro-war. It's about knowing history. Republicans were the ones hitching to go in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Many worship Reagan, yet they love to lick Russian boots.

Many hate radical Muslims, but would be just as ruthless if they had the power.

I could go on.

 

[Jack V Savage]

I disagree that there wouldn't be argument about it. Crossdresser reading books to kids, as an example? lol. In my estimation there seems to be a push to normalize the abnormal, or uncommon, especially when kids are separated from their parents. I think it's great that FLA subsidizes parents choosing schools for their kids in that regard.

From a personal anecdote: my 5 year old was at the gym daycare. she doesn't need a sitter, those are for 3 and under. The gym sitter is a young 20's trans man (biological female). While my 5 year old played with her friend, they were pretending to be mermaids. They asked the sitter to be a mermaid with them. The trans man, with tits and a vag, long hair, obviously visually a biological female, had to tell my 5 year old "I'm a merman. Not a mermaid. I'm not a female." My 5 year old asked what a female was. The sitter took it upon herself to educate my 5 year old, as I walked in on her explaining why she was a merman and not a mermaid even though they had the same "body parts" but she was really a man. I lost my shit (nicely). The young 'man' explained why the conversation occurred and I let them know I don't want their help explaining gender differences to my child who barely isn't a toddler and that shouldn't be an expectation of their presence in the gym daycare. He was super offended that I didn't want him explaining their gender to my child. When I spoke to the gym owner they apologized but cited that the young man called me "transphobic." It just seems wild to me that someone would initiate that conversation with a 5 year old, which, apparently Floridians agree with me in context to school. THAT is exactly what I don't want 5 year olds to go through, especially mine. For the record, when my daughter asks if we can pretend to be mermaids, I just say okay. I don't feel a need to explain the differences in gender to a 5 year old over mermaidism. I find it creepy and weird. I probably won't be wearing a seashell bra, though, lol.

Interesting. I'm surprised that that happened. Only trans person I've ever met (sort of met) was working the register at Safeway. Always seemed creepy and weird to me that it's an issue that people are so obsessed with. The incident doesn't sound like it was traumatizing or anything. Maybe mildly annoying to you.

I think businesses should be treated equally. I think Disney, due to its economic influence, has a lot of lateral mobility in positioning. If they're going to deal in matters of propaganda and false narratives they run the risk of politicians returning them to earth on benefits so that they're no different than anyone else.

Well, that's the point, right? Disney is being punished by the governor for disagreeing with him--they're not being treated equally. There isn't a general objection to these special districts, and it seems like a mutually beneficial arrangement. It really just comes down to how much power you think the governor should have and whether you think people should be allowed to openly express disagreement without gov't retaliation.

 

[Michaelangelo]

Looks like Disney needs to up their lobbyist game

 

[Poatan Power]

Interesting. I'm surprised that that happened. Only trans person I've ever met (sort of met) was working the register at Safeway. Always seemed creepy and weird to me that it's an issue that people are so obsessed with. The incident doesn't sound like it was traumatizing or anything. Maybe mildly annoying to you.



Well, that's the point, right? Disney is being punished by the governor for disagreeing with him--they're not being treated equally. There isn't a general objection to these special districts, and it seems like a mutually beneficial arrangement. It really just comes down to how much power you think the governor should have and whether you think people should be allowed to openly express disagreement without gov't retaliation.

not traumatizing (I don’t think), just confusing. I’ve only met trans individuals through working in the ER, which 100% of the time is in context to mental illness, suicidal ideation and on a 5150 for danger to self. That’s literally 100% of my interactions in California that I’m aware of, other than the gym sitter.

in terms of the governor, I suppose my position is if you have extra benefits for being super successful, but directly
Oppose the people of your state on legislation and public positioning (and by connection, the governor) and you get rooted closer to earth with all other businesses it’s a correction. If you’re being unjustly legislated against that isn’t okay. If you’re losing privileges you otherwise maybe shouldn’t have had, it’s a correction.

time will tell, but, I feel like what we see in Florida is par for the course in politics in general throughout my lifetime all the way back to government contracts post 9/11.

 

[Islam Imamate]

Curious why you want a Florida governor in the white house. Lol

Because I'm a FloBro.

 

[Islam Imamate]

This really such an amusing thread. Watching a bunch of leftists lose their minds because a multi-billion dollar company loses some of its self governing privileges and then call conservative posters hacks for acknowledging the vast majority of companies can't self-govern. In fact I've never heard of a company having these type of privileges before this incident. No one should be surprised a conservative governor appointed like minded people to the board to oversee this. That's how it works. Democrat governors don't go around appointing people they disagree with as well.

I think you're missing the point that DeSantis retaliated against Disney for publicly disagreeing with him and then imposed political control over the company. For a lot of people that's a worrying sign. I have a friend who is fairly right leaning in terms of his economic outlook but he's probably the biggest DeSantis hater among my friends because of these kinds of moves. I used to defend DeSantis because he undid some bad moves by Scott and because he has a solid record on the environment but I just can't anymore in light of stuff like this.

 

[Jack V Savage]

not traumatizing (I don’t think), just confusing. I’ve only met trans individuals through working in the ER, which 100% of the time is in context to mental illness, suicidal ideation and on a 5150 for danger to self. That’s literally 100% of my interactions in California that I’m aware of, other than the gym sitter.

in terms of the governor, I suppose my position is if you have extra benefits for being super successful, but directly
Oppose the people of your state on legislation and public positioning (and by connection, the governor) and you get rooted closer to earth with all other businesses it’s a correction. If you’re being unjustly legislated against that isn’t okay. If you’re losing privileges you otherwise maybe shouldn’t have had, it’s a correction.

time will tell, but, I feel like what we see in Florida is par for the course in politics in general throughout my lifetime all the way back to government contracts post 9/11.

I think what we're seeing in Florida is the first steps of an increasingly boldly authoritarian movement. I don't think it's going to fly in the country as a whole, but we'll see. I think RDS's presidential campaign is likely to flop hard.

 

[Jack V Savage]

I think you're missing the point that DeSantis retaliated against Disney for publicly disagreeing with him and then imposed political control over the company. For a lot of people that's a worrying sign. I have a friend who is fairly right leaning in terms of his economic outlook but he's probably the biggest DeSantis hater among my friends because of these kinds of moves. I used to defend DeSantis because he undid some bad moves by Scott and because he has a solid record on the environment but I just can't anymore in light of stuff like this.

And the obvious hackishness comes from the inconsistency. Imagine if Hochul was trying to hurt Fox and make them more left-wing by using gov't power. There is no chance at all that anyone who is defending RDS here would be OK with it, and I doubt any of RDS's critics would defend it.

 

[Islam Imamate]

Keep in mind that Sherdog is a private business and Florida is a government? I'll try.

I know that you think you're making some kind of point about hypocrisy but even you have to realize just how bad a comparison that was...right? When have the rules on how a business should operate ever been comparable to how a democratic government should operate? It's kind of crazy that you think they're similar enough that you typed that statement without hesitation.

He knows how absolutely dumb that post was, hence why he edited it to change the meaning completely. What a goofball.

 

[Mr Holmes]

I think you're missing the point that DeSantis retaliated against Disney for publicly disagreeing with him and then imposed political control over the company. For a lot of people that's a worrying sign. I have a friend who is fairly right leaning in terms of his economic outlook but he's probably the biggest DeSantis hater among my friends because of these kinds of moves. I used to defend DeSantis because he undid some bad moves by Scott and because he has a solid record on the environment but I just can't anymore in light of stuff like this.

I'm going to disagree that it was merely a disagreement with DeSantis. They were objecting to Floridians' anti-groomer values.

Consider a scenario where a company in Cali was unnecessarily receiving special privileges for a long time and they strongly opposed green or woke equity programs. I would assume they would have their privileges taken from them at some point.

 

[Islam Imamate]

I'm going to disagree that it was merely a disagreement with DeSantis. They were objecting to Floridians' anti-groomer values.

It was a disagreement over the bill which shouldn't invite retribution IMO and the fact that it did is a bad sign which can create a chilling effect.

Besides the bill isn't really about grooming, its about differences over whether LGBT topics are appropriate for kids. There's a discussion to be had there and I'm not entirely unsympathetic to the right wing view here but either way the governor retaliating against one of the largest employers in the state over a public disagreement is a really bad look.

Consider a scenario where a company in Cali was unnecessarily receiving special privileges for a long time and they strongly opposed green or woke equity programs. I would assume they would have their privileges taken from them at some point.

That would be abhorrent just as it is here. I might disagree with the values and politics of a company but the state shouldn't retaliate just because a company openly expresses disagreement with a given political project.

 

[Mr Holmes]

Besides the bill isn't really about grooming, its about differences over whether LGBT topics are appropriate for kids.

Well thats grooming. Just look at that weird Disney exec Karen that forced her young children to be LGBTQIA+ so she can brag about it to all the other Karens in her neighborhood.

That would be abhorrent just as it is here. I might disagree with the values and politics of a company but the state shouldn't retaliate just because a company openly expresses disagreement with a given political project.

I guess I consider it a don't disrespect your host issue. Its hard for me to feel sorry for them.

 

[sickc0d3r]

I guess I consider it a don't disrespect your host issue. Its hard for me to feel sorry for them.

So whoever’s holding power in government at a given time is the host we shouldn’t disrespect? Yikes!

 

[Mr Holmes]

So whoever’s holding power in government at a given time is the host we shouldn’t disrespect? Yikes!

Didn't they just have an election and DeSantis won by a sizable margin?

 

[LangfordBarrow]

Great post and hit the nail on the head at the end there. Trump doesn't really have any strong convictions outside of what helps him get elected, Desantis on the other hand. When you look at what he has signed into law and how his religion not only underpins his world view but directs his politics, it's concerning when combined with his authoritarian ways. When he says stuff like this, he's dead serious:

What message is DeSantis sending with religious ‘full armor of God’ rhetoric?
TALLAHASSEE — While visiting a private Christian college in southern Michigan that wields influence in national politics, Gov. Ron DeSantis rephrased a biblical passage to deliver a message to conservatives.

“Put on the full armor of God. Stand firm against the left’s schemes. You will face flaming arrows, but if you have the shield of faith, you will overcome them, and in Florida we walk the line here,” DeSantis told the audience at Hillsdale College in February. “And I can tell you this, I have only begun to fight.”
https://www.tampabay.com/news/flori...ng-with-religious-full-armor-of-god-rhetoric/

Ron DeErgodan...

 

[koquerelle]

I think you're missing the point that DeSantis retaliated against Disney for publicly disagreeing with him and then imposed political control over the company. For a lot of people that's a worrying sign. I have a friend who is fairly right leaning in terms of his economic outlook but he's probably the biggest DeSantis hater among my friends because of these kinds of moves. I used to defend DeSantis because he undid some bad moves by Scott and because he has a solid record on the environment but I just can't anymore in light of stuff like this.

It should be. I can't believe DeSantis' move is not universally decried. It sets a bad precedent.

 

[LangfordBarrow]

So you're totally fine with a multi billion dollar company getting special privileges after expressing opposition to its host area's values. Got it.

By host area do you mean the whole state or the suburbs around the park? I have a friend that won a lottery to purchase a property in the surrounding area and she's a big lefty so I'm not sure you're being accurate.