Rocky Marciano or Floyd Mayweather Jr. - Who had the better career?

[KAZSoliloquy]

Walcott was a full-fledged HW and a bit bigger than Marciano, even accounting for their size at their HW peaks. He was a full-fledged several years past his best, but still a full-fledged HW. Charles, on the other hand, only went to HW because it had become clear he was never getting a title shot at LHW, despite being far and away the best at the weight. He could have finished his career at LHW if he had wanted. When he peaked as a HW, he weighed between 180-185 pounds. Marciano's wins against them are still very impressive (Charles had slipped a bit as a HW by the time he fought Marciano as he was 3 years removed from KO'd and losing his title against Walcott), but they should be held in context.

that era is a MW-LHW era in my eyes. that's where the best fighters were. zale, graziano, lamotta, cerdan, robinson, burley, charles, johnson, walcott, etc. the heavyweight division of the late 40's through the early 50's is probably the worst it's ever been. also, charles was far past his best when he fought rocky, imo. he had been through so many brutal wars in the years leading up to his heavyweight run.

 

[Hagler]

I mean, alright. The thread is about who had the better career. It's more or less impossible to argue for Marciano if we're going by established metrics for these discussions (some combination of quantity of top wins, level of dominance, quality of opposition, longevity). You can appreciate Marciano and still acknowledge there's only one answer to the thread question.

Marciano tends to get a little underrated at times in the HW ATG discussions, so his fans can get defensive. Also, Floyd could easily be considered as an annoying douchebag, so it is tempting to downplay what he has achieved and find reasons to pick Rocky over him..

As you put it a reasonable way to set this whole thing is that Floyd had the greater career, but Rocky's achievements still deserve proper recognition - ie, if his "0" wasn't the same af Floyd's, it wasn't Sven Ottke's either.

 

[JayE]

Marciano tends to get a little underrated at times in the HW ATG discussions, so his fans can get defensive. Also, Floyd could easily be considered as an annoying douchebag, so it is tempting to downplay what he has achieved and find reasons to pick Rocky over him..

As you put it a reasonable way to set this whole thing is that Floyd had the greater career, but Rocky's achievements still deserve some recognition - ie, if his "0" wasn't the same af Floyd's, it wasn't Sven Ottke's either.

Marciano obviously deserves a lot of respect. Hell, people forget that Ali had a ton of respect for Marciano. His career is very impressive, especially when you take into account that he started late and had to retire early due to chronic injuries.

 

[JayE]

that era is a MW-LHW era in my eyes. that's where the best fighters were. zale, graziano, lamotta, cerdan, robinson, burley, charles, johnson, walcott, etc. the heavyweight division of the late 40's through the early 50's is probably the worst it's ever been. also, charles was far past his best when he fought rocky, imo. he had been through so many brutal wars in the years leading up to his heavyweight run.

Yeah, it was an incredibly deep 10-15 year period around those weights. Also coincided with the time of Pep and Saddler at FW.

 

[deucesarewild]

I would say that Rocky is a special fighter, but a crude brawler, regardless of power and tenacity, is not a nightmare matchup for Mayweather. Thats all.

Maybe jt's the word "nightmare." Pressure combined with activity has been the way to win rounds against Mayweather. Rocky has those and he doesn't slow or get discouraged. Big problem for Floyd. Again, since I have preference either way with regards to the topic of this thread I can say that it certainly ain't some dream

 

[deucesarewild]

i said same size or smaller. he was bigger than moore and the same size as charles and walcott. i didn’t include louis as a “great fighter” he beat because as you can see, louis was almost 40 and had been fighting once every year or two for the better part of a decade.

the “dumb point” comment was in response to you using reach and height as concrete evidence of overall size.

Joe had an eight fight win streak over the period of ONE year prior to him facing Rocky. It wasn't inactivity that got him. It was him being old, firstly, and facing a legit all time great heavyweight.

Just clarifying that error.

 

[KAZSoliloquy]

Joe had an eight fight win streak over the period of ONE year prior to him facing Rocky. It wasn't inactivity that got him. It was him being old, firstly, and facing a legit all time great heavyweight.

Just clarifying that error.

not an error. between 1942 and 1950, joe louis was a career celebrity. he became a propaganda recruitment tool for black soldiers during wartime, doing the bidding of elite whites despite never actually having to see combat. he took 8 years off, essentially, after obliterating the heavyweight division, only fighting in glorified exhibitions, and only came back to boxing to dig himself out of debt.

 

[deucesarewild]

not an error. between 1942 and 1950, joe louis was a career celebrity. he became a propaganda recruitment tool for black soldiers during wartime, doing the bidding of elite whites despite never actually having to see combat. he took 8 years off, essentially, after obliterating the heavyweight division, only fighting in glorified exhibitions, and only came back to boxing to dig himself out of debt.

Yeah, I don't really give a shit about the social justice in this context as it has not even tangential bearing on the purpose of this thread.

You said inactive going into his Rocky fight. He had plenty of fights before facing Rocky (eight). The year before fighting Rocky, Louis lost to Charles and then racked off 8 wins, so if you want to make a claim about inactivity, look at the 2 years of literally not boxing from his Jersey Joe KO win to his Charles loss.

(And, I don't think you were whitewashing ALL the bouts from 42 to 50 as glorified exhibitions because that is just another fallacy that would be wrongfully perpetuated)

 

[Badr Hari]

he took 8 years off, essentially, after obliterating the heavyweight division, only fighting in glorified exhibitions

Wtf? His legendary fights with Walcott happened during that time.

 

[KAZSoliloquy]

Wtf? His legendary fights with Walcott happened during that time.

and louis was a part-time fighter for those too.

Yeah, I don't really give a shit about the social justice in this context as it has not even tangential bearing on the purpose of this thread.

You said inactive going into his Rocky fight. He had plenty of fights before facing Rocky (eight). The year before fighting Rocky, Louis lost to Charles and then racked off 8 wins, so if you want to make a claim about inactivity, look at the 2 years of literally not boxing from his Jersey Joe KO win to his Charles loss.

(And, I don't think you were whitewashing ALL the bouts from 42 to 50 as glorified exhibitions because that is just another fallacy that would be wrongfully perpetuated)

i suppose i could have clarified. yes he went on a short win streak before challenging marciano. that win streak came after a long period of part-time fighting in louis’ thirties & dodging taxes. he was beyond past his prime. he was past past his prime

 

[bobStash]

prime castillo twice, prime marquez, judah, mosley, cotto, pacquiao, canelo, de la hoya, hatton, corrales. no losses.

that’s one of the most impressive resumés we will ever see. very few can stack up against that.

You forgot McGregor.

 

[pakimahi]

By Floyd's logic, I'd give it to Rocky. Rocky was the undefeated heavyweight champion of the world, at 185 pounds.
That would be like Floyd beeing undeafeted champion at super middleweight.

 

[listrahtes]

This thread is mostly about people having no clue at all about Rocky Marciano and HW boxing in that time.

Then they google some stats and voila an "opinion" is born. Its painful to read all that retarded blabber.

 

[Fluffernutter]

Floyd kept the average Joe that interested in a sport that sports center avoids.

 

[PUO3]

This thread is mostly about people having no clue at all about Rocky Marciano and HW boxing in that time.

Then they google some stats and voila an "opinion" is born. Its painful to read all that retarded blabber.

Were you watching him live back then? If not, you likely base your opinion on the same available materials as the rest of us.

Careful up there on that high horse.

 

[Ancient Warrior]

If Rock had stuck around a little longer and whipped a legit terror like Liston, I’d give it to him.

 

[Ramon Antonio]

Floyd. All the greats Rocky defeated were washed up when he fought them.

Didn't Rocky start at like 25 or something himself.

 

[FierceRedBelt]

Didn't Rocky start at like 25 or something himself.

Yes, it's silly to compare someone who had gloves on at 2 years old and someone who learned to fight in his mid-20s.

 

[BoTyson]

Can't say i was alive to know much about Rocky Marciano but from what i have seen over Floyds career i put him in my top 3 all time with RJJ & Ali.

 

[deucesarewild]

Were you watching him live back then? If not, you likely base your opinion on the same available materials as the rest of us.

Careful up there on that high horse.

Except some read EVERYTHING and watch everything they can, while others scroll through boxrec. Having access to, and using, are usually not the same thing. The man has a point, even if he isn't 138 years old like Joe Louis was when he fought Rocky.