Opinion Should The Next James Bond Be A Woman? Daniel Craig Makes His Feelings Crystal Clear

[I Am Legion]

But they did make the hulk red and smart along with several other manifestations. Red hulk was a criminal even. .

Changing these characters up is nothing new. It would be new not to innovate.

It’s not innovation. Innovation would be to create something new and refreshing. It’s Hollywood taking advantage of an angle to pander to bullshit. And you are right about comic book stuff, but Bond isn’t that. His very essence is based on being a male. You change that, it isn’t Bond. Would you make The Black Panther or Shaft white? Would you make Rocky gay?

 

[panamaican]

Because you are not a fan. Also it doesn't appeal to actual fans so this chl



Your inability to understand stems from the fact that you aren't a fan yourself. This isn't rocket science.

I'm a fan of other things that have had their stories altered or retconned. Frankly the majority of the people who are complaining about these things aren't diehard fans either. They're casuals.

 

[RandomUser12]

The days of strong, masculine, heroic white characters being portrayed in movies and television are over. They will definitely have someone like Idris Elba playing Bond in the near future, and he'll be paired up with the most Nordic looking white woman imaginable to engage in very explicit sex scenes in between killing evil, cowardly, physically inept white villains.

These products are nothing more than a humiliation ritual at this point. It's not about giving others a platform or opportunity to shine, it's about culturally belittling and degrading a racial enemy while they demographically replace them.

It's not black people who own Hollywood, by the way.

 

[panamaican]

We're talking about modern creativity Pan, not folklore that varies through time.

We're talking about people virtue signalling to avoid creation - it's a direct symptom of laziness in an uninspired society.

We're also not talking about one or two outliers over centuries. We're talking about hundreds, if not thousands of rehashed stories (of modern origin no less) in the last decade.

There's no difference between modern creativity and folklore. Folklore was modern creativity when it was originated. It's a very uninformed perspective on history to always believe that what's happening now is new and not part of the same things people have been doing forever.

I used the Grimm example because they're well known. But over the years, it's hundreds and thousands of rehashed stories. Anecdotally, I listen to a couple of podcasts that tell folklore and mythology stories from around the world. Pretty much every story has 3-4 different versions depending on which author chose to write it down at the time. Sometimes the variations are massive, sometimes they're minimal.

If I was so inclined to argue the point, I would say that the lack of creativity arises in those people who can't fathom new versions of things. "What if...?" is pretty much the baseline of a lot of creative thought. What if the phone also was a computer? These people complaining would be saying "No, that's a lack of creativity. Instead of combining a phone with a computer, leave phones alone and leave computers alone." Or "What if we put an engine on a bicycle?" The complainers would say "No, that's a lack of creativity. Leave the bicycle the way it was and go make something else with a motor."

It's not particularly creative to continue to rehash the same thing over and over again and pretend that is more creative than moving the story in a completely new direction. The new direction might fail but it requires more creative effort than minor adjustments. And I say this as a fan of some very repetitive video game series, like Dynasty Warriors, which rehashes the same story every iteration.

 

[terrapin]

It’s not innovation. Innovation would be to create something new and refreshing. It’s Hollywood taking advantage of an angle to pander to bullshit. And you are right about comic book stuff, but Bond isn’t that. His very essence is based on being a male. You change that, it isn’t Bond. Would you make The Black Panther or Shaft white? Would you make Rocky gay?

This kind of innovation is an extension of what the printed comics have always been doing it is innovation and change and to not do it would be a break from tradition in my opinion.

 

[spamking]

They get upset, (and yes, some people get UPSET) because they are boring no life having losers.

It's as simple as that.

 

[Natural Order]

There's no difference between modern creativity and folklore. Folklore was modern creativity when it was originated. It's a very uninformed perspective on history to always believe that what's happening now is new and not part of the same things people have been doing forever.

I used the Grimm example because they're well known. But over the years, it's hundreds and thousands of rehashed stories. Anecdotally, I listen to a couple of podcasts that tell folklore and mythology stories from around the world. Pretty much every story has 3-4 different versions depending on which author chose to write it down at the time. Sometimes the variations are massive, sometimes they're minimal.

If I was so inclined to argue the point, I would say that the lack of creativity arises in those people who can't fathom new versions of things. "What if...?" is pretty much the baseline of a lot of creative thought. What if the phone also was a computer? These people complaining would be saying "No, that's a lack of creativity. Instead of combining a phone with a computer, leave phones alone and leave computers alone." Or "What if we put an engine on a bicycle?" The complainers would say "No, that's a lack of creativity. Leave the bicycle the way it was and go make something else with a motor."

It's not particularly creative to continue to rehash the same thing over and over again and pretend that is more creative than moving the story in a completely new direction. The new direction might fail but it requires more creative effort than minor adjustments. And I say this as a fan of some very repetitive video game series, like Dynasty Warriors, which rehashes the same story every iteration.

Japanese musou ftw!

We’re in a creativity crisis imo, and it’ll only get worse. Ingenuity and fresh ideas are what keep our games/masks going. Part of this is a symptom and problem inherent with capitalism and we’re seeing it on full display now.

I have no problem with variations on existing ideas, but when the focal point for that variation stems from political/ ideological slants it appears lazy and being done for the wrong reason.

If you like DW, try out One Piece Pirates 3/4, pretty entertaining beat em up in same style.

 

[ModernMatt]

They already did this dumb shit with Ghostbusters. I guess they haven't learned....

i didn't watch it, but my friend did...and he told me how bad it was and said that basically its anti-men. How defeating the big ghost/monster was shooting it in the genitals.

I'm all up for girl power, but if the premise of your movie is just to say "look, we're doing a female version and thats the main plot plus majority of jokes are towards men"...then you know its really not going to be a good movie.

 

[Takes_Two_To_Tango]

They should just scrap the whole Bond franchise. It's garbage, I haven't watched Bond in ages. Jason Bourne is more interesting than Bond.

 

[machidafan99]

They destroyed the characters long ago. Barbara Broccoli is the cause.

 

[skysolo]

There are literally 100s of books and comic characters about female spies and heroes that a crappy movie could be based on. So I don't know why they need to just change an established male character to a female one.

Can we do anything other than "the same but different"?

 

[spamking]

Again . . . why the need to rework an existing movie franchise character? Why not just build out a new one and start something fresh? Female leads in roles as a spy isn't something new anyway.

It's not like there isn't already tons of source material out there to pick from to create some female James Bond-like character.

 

[DoctorDeelon]

I don't see the appeal of hijacking franchises with "woke" ideals. There are a ton of movies with female ass-kicking leads.

There is also an infinite amount of new franchises you can create. Want a trans PoC struggling with mental health issues who is also a top anti-fascist fighter who battles evil right wing extremists? Cool, make that movie and let the public decide if it's good or not. Stop trying to hijack existing IPs.

 

[DoctorDeelon]

There are literally 100s of books and comic characters about female spies and heroes that a crappy movie could be based on. So I don't know why they need to just change an established male character to a female one.

Can we do anything other than "the same but different"?

True. They actually did a "Jane Bond" comic in the UK I believe.

 

[panamaican]

Japanese musou ftw!

We’re in a creativity crisis imo, and it’ll only get worse. Ingenuity and fresh ideas are what keep our games/masks going. Part of this is a symptom and problem inherent with capitalism and we’re seeing it on full display now.

I have no problem with variations on existing ideas, but when the focal point for that variation stems from political/ ideological slants it appears lazy and being done for the wrong reason.

If you like DW, try out One Piece Pirates 3/4, pretty entertaining beat em up in same style.

I completely disagree. There's isn't a lack of creativity. If there is, it's not new. TV has been rehashing the same sitcom storylines, crime procedural dramas for years. Decades before TV, they were rehashing the same plays, operas and ballets. And every generation modified the stories to match their era. Looking at Bond and arguing for more of the same is probably the worst example of criticizing a lack of creativity from others. People are saying "They're not creative because they're completely changing something. True creativity would be to roll out the same thing that I've been watching since the 1960s."

That's creativity? Then again there are people who still buy EA's Madden football game every year...

Or the other "lack of creativity" argument -- why don't they make new characters. An argument that only makes sense if you ignore all of the new characters that get rolled out over the years. Just in the female spy space -- Salt, Atomic Blonde, Red Sparrow. They've added more white males as well -- Kingsman, Bourne Trilogy, etc. They've rehashed white female movies too -- Charlie's Angels and it's numerous different female groups.

There are so many new characters that I never take anyone seriously who asks why they don't make new ones.

The problem isn't that they're rehashing, altering or retconning old characters into new ones. Or that they don't create new characters. The problem is that some people simply can't fathom that some changes that they oppose are enjoyed by others so they attempt to diminish other people's preferences by assigning it the most dismissive reasoning possible. "They're not doing X because there's an audience for it. They're doing it for an empty gesture."

That's the real issue in our society today. People who can't fathom that there's a genuine audience for something that they don't like. I think it's retarded. These are businesses. They're not going to alter existing stories unless there's enough genuine audience interest to warrant it. To return to Bond -- does any intelligent person think that producers would spend a hundred million dollars tearing down the Bond franchise just to virtue signal? That people in the movie making business, trying to make massive earnings, are intentionally making movies that they know the audience doesn't want?

If people believe that then we definitely don't have a creativity problem, we have a bunch of idiots problem.

 

[koquerelle]

I completely disagree. There's isn't a lack of creativity. If there is, it's not new. TV has been rehashing the same sitcom storylines, crime procedural dramas for years. Decades before TV, they were rehashing the same plays, operas and ballets. And every generation modified the stories to match their era. Looking at Bond and arguing for more of the same is probably the worst example of criticizing a lack of creativity from others. People are saying "They're not creative because they're completely changing something. True creativity would be to roll out the same thing that I've been watching since the 1960s."

That's creativity? Then again there are people who still buy EA's Madden football game every year...

Or the other "lack of creativity" argument -- why don't they make new characters. An argument that only makes sense if you ignore all of the new characters that get rolled out over the years. Just in the female spy space -- Salt, Atomic Blonde, Red Sparrow. They've added more white males as well -- Kingsman, Bourne Trilogy, etc. They've rehashed white female movies too -- Charlie's Angels and it's numerous different female groups.

There are so many new characters that I never take anyone seriously who asks why they don't make new ones.

The problem isn't that they're rehashing, altering or retconning old characters into new ones. Or that they don't create new characters. The problem is that some people simply can't fathom that some changes that they oppose are enjoyed by others so they attempt to diminish other people's preferences by assigning it the most dismissive reasoning possible. "They're not doing X because there's an audience for it. They're doing it for an empty gesture."

That's the real issue in our society today. People who can't fathom that there's a genuine audience for something that they don't like. I think it's retarded. These are businesses. They're not going to alter existing stories unless there's enough genuine audience interest to warrant it. To return to Bond -- does any intelligent person think that producers would spend a hundred million dollars tearing down the Bond franchise just to virtue signal? That people in the movie making business, trying to make massive earnings, are intentionally making movies that they know the audience doesn't want?

If people believe that then we definitely don't have a creativity problem, we have a bunch of idiots problem.

The amount of energy you spend on trying to convince people they're wrong is ridiculous (even more so since you're not a fan of 007). We get it. You're a genius and everybody else is wrong.

 

[Morning Star]

They should just scrap the whole Bond franchise. It's garbage, I haven't watched Bond in ages. Jason Bourne is more interesting than Bond.

Mission Impossible has been so much better the last decade or so, Craig is a bore. They need to recast, not a woman though unless they want to kill the franchise. There's plenty of better options available.

 

[A Lurker]

Personally I like the idea, as long as they drop all the spy stuff, focus solely on the womanising and make it X rated.

Best bond film ever.

 

[Morning Star]

The amount of energy you spend on trying to convince people they're wrong is ridiculous (even more so since you're not a fan of 007). We get it. You're a genius and everybody else is wrong.

Do yourself a favor and scroll past his mini-novels. That guy is one of the most long winded, empty worded, disingenuous posters on here.

 

[Natural Order]

I completely disagree. There's isn't a lack of creativity. If there is, it's not new. TV has been rehashing the same sitcom storylines, crime procedural dramas for years. Decades before TV, they were rehashing the same plays, operas and ballets. And every generation modified the stories to match their era. Looking at Bond and arguing for more of the same is probably the worst example of criticizing a lack of creativity from others. People are saying "They're not creative because they're completely changing something. True creativity would be to roll out the same thing that I've been watching since the 1960s."

That's creativity? Then again there are people who still buy EA's Madden football game every year...

Or the other "lack of creativity" argument -- why don't they make new characters. An argument that only makes sense if you ignore all of the new characters that get rolled out over the years. Just in the female spy space -- Salt, Atomic Blonde, Red Sparrow. They've added more white males as well -- Kingsman, Bourne Trilogy, etc. They've rehashed white female movies too -- Charlie's Angels and it's numerous different female groups.

There are so many new characters that I never take anyone seriously who asks why they don't make new ones.

The problem isn't that they're rehashing, altering or retconning old characters into new ones. Or that they don't create new characters. The problem is that some people simply can't fathom that some changes that they oppose are enjoyed by others so they attempt to diminish other people's preferences by assigning it the most dismissive reasoning possible. "They're not doing X because there's an audience for it. They're doing it for an empty gesture."

That's the real issue in our society today. People who can't fathom that there's a genuine audience for something that they don't like. I think it's retarded. These are businesses. They're not going to alter existing stories unless there's enough genuine audience interest to warrant it. To return to Bond -- does any intelligent person think that producers would spend a hundred million dollars tearing down the Bond franchise just to virtue signal? That people in the movie making business, trying to make massive earnings, are intentionally making movies that they know the audience doesn't want?

If people believe that then we definitely don't have a creativity problem, we have a bunch of idiots problem.

Imagine thinking the conversation is this complex.