If Joshua convincingly beats Usyk, where does he rank all-time?

Ruv said:
Usyk going to pick apart this bodybuilder AJ and ruin the all-Britsh Undisputed World Heavyweight Championship fight.

Usyk by UD.
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well if he doesn’t I’ve no doubt wilder probably will. That fight has never felt any further away than it does now
 
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ExitLUPin said:
Fury after that Wilder destruction belongs at the bottom of the list. He's def higher than AJ at the least.

Chisorax2, Cunningham, Hammer, Wlad, Wilderx2, Wallin is good enough considering Fury's dominance in fights, undefeated and ending Wlads reign
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Never defended a title and his 3rd best win is chisora! Joshua’s beaten generally higher level opponents with far fewer fights and has been undisputed champ for 4 out of the last 5 years. Until fury beats Joshua, there’s no real argument to place fury higher. Same goes for Joshua. They are around the same p4p level. Top 20-30 at best for me
 
aries said:
Yeah 60's HW's would shiver in terror if presented with 6'6" 240lb Joshua. They thought Foreman was a monster at 6'3" and 220lbs. Fuck even Usyk would be considered a decent size as he currently weighs 230lb and stands 6'3" but he's considered really small by today's standards.
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How about the 1950's heavyweights, like Rocky Marciano? 5''10 and 68 inch reach! Those are Lobov dimensions, even Cory Sandhagen was taller and longer. You got to think modern Canelo would beat lots of these historic heavyweights.

Whats scary about these new guys, like Fury, is he is nearly 7 feet but moves like Willie Pep. Even Ali would be a cruiserweight by today's standards. The game has evolved so much.
 
aries said:
Do you think the fact that Floyd never gassed was that he was a midget compared to Joshua who is 6'6" and 240lbs of solid muscle? I agree that Joshua needs to focus on his conditioning BUT to say that only training like Floyd would help because Floyd never gassed is asinine. If Floyd was 6'6" and 240lb I think he'd have stamina issues too.
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It doesn't matter Evander had incredible conditioning and recovery from throwing combinations, Ali went life and death against Frazier for 15 rounds they didn't show the fatigue that Joshua shows only after throwing a simple combo hurting Klitchko and Ruiz he gassed after knocking Ruiz down and getting caught himself there's no way he should've gassed being buzzed is different from being gassed when your buzzed like that you get on your toes Boxing moving jabbing throwing combos then clinching or moving you should have the energy to box but Joshua couldn't do anything.
 
Seano said:
How is everyone putting Fury in there with Ali and Lennox Lewis? Fury has beaten Wilder and Wlad, most casual fans couldn't name another opponent he fought without using boxrec. Johsua has fought and beaten better opposition than Fury.
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Well, Fury beat a younger Klit and more dominantly. He also beat Wilder, who again was the #1 guy in the world, and never lost. Josh still lacks that massive hallmark win and took an L on the way.

There are two ways to look at this:
1)the time machine way (i.e. what would happen if you put Rocky Marciano in a time machine and he fought Fury)
2) looking at things thru the context of it's time.

The race horse Dan Patch was the most popular athlete in the world at the turn of the 20th century and it was considered an impossible feat when he broke the 2 minute mile, people thought it would never be done again.......fast forward 100 years and even the lowest level pacers are breaking 2 minutes in local claiming races. Point is, all sports improve over time. With Fury, he likely has a chance vs any heavyweight that ever lived if you had a time machine - he would tower over Foreman and Liston, who were considered giants in there day, not to mention Fury moves like a small man. But to your point, he certainly has not amassed the title defense and legacy hallmarks of some of the other guys on the list. I guess it's really your value system and how you approach these comparisons across time. I would definitely give Fury an excellent shot against any version Lewis or Muhammad Ali.
 
tekkennlee said:
It doesn't matter Evander had incredible conditioning and recovery from throwing combinations, Ali went life and death against Frazier for 15 rounds they didn't show the fatigue that Joshua shows only after throwing a simple combo hurting Klitchko and Ruiz he gassed after knocking Ruiz down and getting caught himself there's no way he should've gassed being buzzed is different from being gassed when your buzzed like that you get on your toes Boxing moving jabbing throwing combos then clinching or moving you should have the energy to box but Joshua couldn't do anything.
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AJ was concussed from the first big shot Ruiz landed, he never fully recovered right up until the stoppage. That wasn't being gassed that was being concussed. Whether you believe the rumours that he was coming into the fight after not long ago being concussed during training, he still got concussed by Ruiz. Again non of the HW's you mentioned are the size of AJ.
 
aries said:
AJ was concussed from the first big shot Ruiz landed, he never fully recovered right up until the stoppage. That wasn't being gassed that was being concussed. Whether you believe the rumours that he was coming into the fight after not long ago being concussed during training, he still got concussed by Ruiz. Again non of the HW's you mentioned are the size of AJ.
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Riddick Bowe didn't gass until he started not training properly neither did Lennox Lewis and he's Joshua size but not as cut, Bowe when in shape went life and death against Holyfield three times, when lazy he almost got stopped but low blows thrown by Goltota saved him from two losses so being in shape matters if Bowe was in the correct shape Gollota doesn't touch him.

If Joshua gets concussed and doesn't recover after one knockdown like that against Ruiz who isn't known as a monstrous puncher well he's in serious trouble going against better talent and bigger punchers in the future because if Ruiz can do that much damage then others will do worse.
 
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tekkennlee said:
If Joshua gets concussed and doesn't recover after one knockdown like that against Ruiz who isn't known as a monstrous puncher well he's in serious trouble going against better talent and bigger punchers in the future because if Ruiz can do that much damage then others will do worse.
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The rumours were that Joshua was recently concussed going into that fight from sparring and that's what it looked like. He recovered fine from when Klitschko landed his bombs. Who hits harder Klitschko or Ruiz?
 
As someone from England and a fan of Joshua, i really hope Usyk pulls the upset and wins. Sick of all this kissy kissy chasey chasey with the big 3.
 
tekkennlee said:
Riddick Bowe didn't gass until he started not training properly neither did Lennox Lewis and he's Joshua size but not as cut, Bowe when in shape went life and death against Holyfield three times, when lazy he almost got stopped but low blows thrown by Goltota saved him from two losses so being in shape matters if Bowe was in the correct shape Gollota doesn't touch him.

If Joshua gets concussed and doesn't recover after one knockdown like that against Ruiz who isn't known as a monstrous puncher well he's in serious trouble going against better talent and bigger punchers in the future because if Ruiz can do that much damage then others will do worse.
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Joshua’s already beaten bigger punchers and better fighters than ruiz? And it’s rarely about how hard you get hit, it’s where the punch lands that generally causes the damage

He got caught, couldn’t recover and lost the fight. This happens to virtually every pro fighter that steps through the ropes. Multiple times in most cases. It’s laughable that you hold this against Joshua but give everyone else a pass. He even rematched and shut his opponent out, avenged his loss. Something that almost every fighter in your p4p list hadn’t done, other than Lewis
 
tekkennlee said:
Riddick Bowe didn't gass until he started not training properly neither did Lennox Lewis and he's Joshua size but not as cut, Bowe when in shape went life and death against Holyfield three times, when lazy he almost got stopped but low blows thrown by Goltota saved him from two losses so being in shape matters if Bowe was in the correct shape Gollota doesn't touch him.
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What shite are you rambling on about, Bowe was 235lbs in both the first Holyfield fight and the second Golota fight
 
GeneTunney7 said:
How about the 1950's heavyweights, like Rocky Marciano? 5''10 and 68 inch reach! Those are Lobov dimensions, even Cory Sandhagen was taller and longer. You got to think modern Canelo would beat lots of these historic heavyweights.

Whats scary about these new guys, like Fury, is he is nearly 7 feet but moves like Willie Pep. Even Ali would be a cruiserweight by today's standards. The game has evolved so much.
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Yeah absolutely, modern HW's are a different animal. Like you say Ali would have been a CW.
 
"Modern Canelo beats Marciano" "Fury beats Ali and Lennox" "Fury moves like Willie Pep" LOL It is such a question I knew it would produce some dumb posts and I can say I'm not dissapointed.
 
aries said:
The rumours were that Joshua was recently concussed going into that fight from sparring and that's what it looked like. He recovered fine from when Klitschko landed his bombs. Who hits harder Klitschko or Ruiz?
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Ruiz caught the Temple and threw off his eq
Jonny Ninja said:
Joshua’s already beaten bigger punchers and better fighters than ruiz? And it’s rarely about how hard you get hit, it’s where the punch lands that generally causes the damage

He got caught, couldn’t recover and lost the fight. This happens to virtually every pro fighter that steps through the ropes. Multiple times in most cases. It’s laughable that you hold this against Joshua but give everyone else a pass. He even rematched and shut his opponent out, avenged his loss. Something that almost every fighter in your p4p list hadn’t done, other than Lewis
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Those guys didn't land solid shots on Joshua unlike Ruiz who caught his Temple, then threw his equilibrium off, he wasn't the same after that, unlike other fighters who would've bounced back, Joshua couldn't and he was done. most people see problems with Joshua with his conditioning being bad all of the time, he's hurt by Ruiz and can't bounce back just from a knockdown but Ruiz gets hit flush and he's okay he wins the fight, this is the reality, so I am not bashing the guy, I am actually a fan but the truth is the truth and until he can shows he's fixed those flaws, he will be judged on what we see from him and ranked in the top 30, until he proves otherwise.

Evander went throw loses a knockdown & a knock out and his strange heart problem but he bounced back even stopping Tyson every fighter has flaws except maybe a few like Floyd, who's an all around talent or Whitaker, Roy Jones but greatness is achieved over time and isn't just handed to anybody.
 
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treelo said:
What shite are you rambling on about, Bowe was 235lbs in both the first Holyfield fight and the second Golota fight
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There's a difference in being the same weight and being in shape, you can diet and weigh the same but being in shape is a different story, even Eddie Fuch his trainer said Bowe was a lost cause he put a kitchen in his bedroom, so you know where his heart was it was food eating & eating even more, instead of hiring a personal chef or consulting a weight expert that could teach him how to eat, Eddie said he's gone he's a lost cause and his performance showed this, Lennox blew Golota out of the water easily because he wasn't lazy and didn't have food and training problem but Lennox lost also when he cam in heavy and out of shape, he got stopped he was doing a movie everyone knows because it's bad ass, that Ocean's 11 remake and he admitted not taking that fight serious and paid the price but the next time, the rematch he blew Rohman out of there, easily, so being unfocused, overconfident & laziness cost Lewis a win.
 
aries said:
No Joshua was concussed. I don't know why you want to deny it.
https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2019/sep/13/anthony-joshua-concussion-andy-ruiz-jr-boxing

Joshua recovered fine from the shot that Klitschko landed, and that was a KO blow not a glancing shot. And he recovered after Whyte landed big on him. Again not a glancing blow. But he couldn't recover this time (Ruiz) because he was concussed.
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We get those excuses all of the time no excuses, then he's stupid because his life would be on the line and his record and belts and he lost them, because he wanted to fight even when being hurt concussed this could cause a loss and his health just because he wanted to fight on that day ? not buying that excuse his trainer knows better unless he's also stupid and has no clue what he's doing you simply don't put your fighters life health record in danger when you could just postpone the fight until later no excuses just a stupid corner, his trainer will cost him more fights if he's that incompetent, I would fire his ass, but that excuse is probably fake.
 
tekkennlee said:
We get those excuses all of the time no excuses, then he's stupid because his life would be on the line and his record and belts and he lost them, because he wanted to fight even when being hurt concussed this could cause a loss and his health just because he wanted to fight on that day ? not buying that excuse his trainer knows better unless he's also stupid and has no clue what he's doing you simply don't put your fighters life health record in danger when you could just postpone the fight until later no excuses just a stupid corner, his trainer will cost him more fights if he's that incompetent, I would fire his ass, but that excuse is probably fake.
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True, AJ's tactics in the rematch showed he didn't truly believe the stories he/his camp were peddling. If you lost solely down to an incident in sparring, fight the rematch without said incident and it's a straight forward win. AJ treated Ruiz like he was facing bareknuckle prime Foreman
 
tekkennlee said:
We get those excuses all of the time no excuses, then he's stupid because his life would be on the line and his record and belts and he lost them, because he wanted to fight even when being hurt concussed this could cause a loss and his health just because he wanted to fight on that day ? not buying that excuse his trainer knows better unless he's also stupid and has no clue what he's doing you simply don't put your fighters life health record in danger when you could just postpone the fight until later no excuses just a stupid corner, his trainer will cost him more fights if he's that incompetent, I would fire his ass, but that excuse is probably fake.
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It was obviously fake. And it wasn't even an excuse by Joshua or anyone in his team as they denied it immediately. Even the said boxers who were involved in sparring and their people all denied it. It was like a forum rumor started by fans that spread as news.
 
Badr Hari said:
It was obviously fake. And it wasn't even an excuse by Joshua or anyone in his team as they denied it immediately. Even the said boxers who were involved in sparring and their people all denied it. It was like a forum rumor started by fans that spread as news.
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He had health issues in the lead up to the first Ruiz fight but hasn’t ever said what they was but that they needed fixing even before the rematch
https://www.independent.co.uk/sport...lth-issue-surgery-next-opponent-a9238696.html
 
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